When it comes to looking mixed/biracial/mulatto, is there a different phenotypical expectation based on which country/culture you come from?
oevega wrote:
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This is the phenotype (50-50) of a mulatto person.
This is the first time in my life I've ever heard anyone refer to Naomi Campbell as looking mulatta. To be honest many would consider she, Alec Wek, Grace Jones (when she was popular), Roshumba, and a few others (I just can't think of their names right now) as being some of the blackest models in the business. Would Naomi Campbell truly be thought of as being mixed race/mulatto in Latin America? OR is this an example of the whole "money whitens" thing because she's famous and wealthy?. Or merely a Pavolvian response because Naomi Campbell is attractive? There is a common stereotype (some believe it and some don't) that bi/multiracial people are naturally more attractive than "pure" raced people. Especially stereotypically looking Sub-Saharan blacks. Like it's a given or something.
Louise Vyent is biracial (half Surinamese and half Dutch). Although she is brown and her hair is Afro-textured her features still show a European influence.
Same with former Miss France Sonia Rolland (half French and half Rwandan Tutsi)...
I've noticed many 50/50 (assuming the black parent is from Africa or the Caribbean and not multigenerationaly mixed) biracials in Europe have a similar look.
In North America however, I believe the standard is higher - or shall I say whiter - for what constitutes "biracial looking".
Is this a true observation? And if so is why? I have my opinions but I'd love to hear input from the brilliant minds here at ODR.
Last edited by zsana on Wed 12 Apr 2006 17:07; edited 1 time in total
When it comes to looking mixed/biracial/mulatto, is there a different phenotypical expectation based on which country/culture you come from?
...
This is the first time in my life I've ever heard anyone refer to Naomi Campbell as looking mulatta. To be honest many would consider she, Alec Wek, Grace Jones (when she was popular), Roshumba, and a few others (I just can't think of their names right now) as being some of the blackest models in the business. Would Naomi Campbell truly be thought of as being mixed race/mulatto in Latin America? OR is this an example of the whole "money whitens" thing because she's famous and wealthy?. Or merely a Pavolvian response because Naomi Campbell is attractive? There is a common stereotype (some believe it and some don't) that bi/multiracial people are naturally more attractive than "pure" raced people. Especially stereotypically looking Sub-Saharan blacks. Like it's a given or something.
Louise Vyent is biracial (half Surinamese and half Dutch). Although she is brown and her hair is Afro-textured her features still show a European influence.
...
Same with Sonia Rolland (half French half and half Rwandan Tutsi)...
..
I've noticed many 50/50 (assuming the black parent is from Africa or the Caribbean and not multigenerationaly mixed) biracials in Europe have a similar look.
In North America however, I believe the standard is higher - or shall I say whiter - for what constitutes "biracial looking".
Is this a true observation? And if so is why? I have my opinions but I'd love to hear input from the brilliant minds here at ODR.
Hi,
In Latin America a mulatta is a woman with Black and White parents. Noami an many other "Black" famous people are mulattoes, according to that "definition". Mulatto means mixed in Arab (not Spanish) and applies to all people of Black and White ancestry.
Noami has African and European parents, so she is a mulatta. Mulattoes 50-50 have different skin tones, Noami has dark skin, that's all. She have green eyes as well, if I am not wrong.
Posted: Wed 12 Apr 2006 15:31 Post subject: Different expectations for what constitutes a biracial look?
My sister and I were having this very same discussion last week.
There is a range of phenotypes we associate with black in the U.S. Many biracial people-Tiger Woods, Lenny Kravitz, Boris Kodjoe, Tatiana Ali, Halle Barry-have a "look" that we here in the U.S. see as black. Hence, for many black people and a significant number of whites, a person who is supposed to look biracial is really much lighter with little or no trace of African ancestry; still black, but biracially black if you will. Of course many African Americans look like these people as well, which contributes to this way looking at things.
People like Kimora Lee, The Rock, Wentworth Miller, Mariah Carey, Derek Jetter, are either ambiguous looking or look white or Asian (Kimora Lee), so people, especially non-blacks, are surprised when they find out these folks are half or partially black.
Naomi Campbell – Model, her mother is Black (Jamaican), her father is Multiracial, at least partly Chinese.
If you mean somewhere back in her genetic woodpile there may have been one "pure" European ancestor, I'll agree that's quite possible. But I find it extremely unlikely for someone with her appearance to have one white parent if that's what you litteraly meant by your statement. Maybe that's not what you meant at all and you were simply referring to ancestry. If so - given your definition - sure she could be considered mixed-race. So could everyone on this planet. How many people "black", "white", or other can really say with complete certainty they're 100% of what they claim to be/think they are?
I really want to understand this. In Latin America you can be of completely West-African appearance but because of one mixed race parent or Grandparent you can still be considered Mulatta/Mulatto in spite of your appearance? Even if you're not a professional athlete, fashion model, actor, or celebrity? Wow. So it's kind of like the ODR in reverse then. One drop of "non black blood" and you're no longer considered black? If true this is fascinating considering how very different the mindset is in the U.S.
Naomi herself has admited she never knew her biological father. Therefore he may or may not be of mixed race. Some parents tell their children all sorts of things that turn out to be not true...
CAMPBELL: I don't know my real father but I've got two -- I've got three wonderful great men, one I think you know. One is Quincy Jones, who's like an amazing father figure to me.
KING: I passed him on the street yesterday.
CAMPBELL: You did?
KING: He cut me off.
CAMPBELL: And the other is Chris Blackwell and they have both taken the roles as my father and they both take it very seriously.
KING: Your mother never married?
CAMPBELL: I have a father, stepfather but they're divorced.
KING: So you never knew your father?
CAMPBELL: No.
Naomi naturally has brown eyes but often wears green and sometimes blue contacts. She also wears hair weaves/wigs (as do most female celebrities regardless of "race") which Europeanizes her African looks more so.
Still, even dark 50/50 black white biracials are usually distinguishable from the Naomi Campbells and Tyson Beckfords of the world.
Last edited by zsana on Wed 12 Apr 2006 17:04; edited 5 times in total
Posted: Wed 12 Apr 2006 16:41 Post subject: Re: Different expectations for what constitutes a biracial look?
G-Man wrote:
My sister and I were having this very same discussion last week.
I do not know of any studies done on this, other than Hoetink's (which are a bid outdated) and Kurzban, Tooby, and Cosmides (which aim at children). Nevertheless, the perception of "racial" traits is an interesting topic, so there might well be some new studies out there in journal-space.
From personal experience, I strongly agree that the US perception is strongly skewed towards hypodescent. More than one European, for example, has told me that Halle Berry is no more Black than any other European woman with a St. Tropez tan. (On the other hand, a swarthy Italian-American woman of my acquaintance once told me that she had been considered non-White in New Zealand.)
In Latin America, just having African Ancestry and European ancestry (not always necessary, could be other as some Zambos and Afroasiatics have also been refered to as Mulatos) is the requirement. If you look black but we can notice you have some admixture and it MIGHT/COULD be european, you probably are going tobe called mulata. Many AfroAsiatic and AfroIndigenous people with less marked Indigenous faces have been called mulatas.
Ultimately, mulato used to mean the same as mestizo, mixed. So in certain times of history, Even mixtures that had nothing to do with African ancestry have had the labelof mulato.
Naomi Campbell – Model, her mother is Black (Jamaican), her father is Multiracial, at least partly Chinese.
Hi Zsana:
There you go. Noami is part Jamaican, and quite a lot of Jamaicans are mixed, including Bob Marley, Colin Powell, and other personalities.
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If you mean somewhere back in her genetic woodpile there may have been one "pure" European ancestor, I'll agree that's quite possible. But I find it extremely unlikely for someone with her appearance to have one white parent if that's what you litteraly meant by your statement.
Not really. It all depends on the mixtures. A pure person of Western African type, that have strong Yeruba features and very dark skin, if married with a brown European will almost always have very dark skin. However, facial features will show the European and African influences clearly. Is like the case of Tyger woods, which has dark skin but one see the Asian facial features on him.
In any case, the term Mulatto -In Spanish and Portuguese- usually means a person of mixed European and African ancestry, but it does not describe a precise phenotype. However, as Salssasin pointed out, sometimes the terms Mulatto and Mestizo are not used in their original meaning either.
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Maybe that's not what you meant at all and you were simply referring to ancestry. If so - given your definition - sure she could be considered mixed-race. So could everyone on this planet. How many people "black", "white", or other can really say with complete certainty they're 100% of what they claim to be/think they are?
There is no people which is 100% anything. Pick a pure Nordic population, for instance, and you'll notice many of them does not have "European" features but Asian. Pick Nigerians, for instance, and like it was pointed out before, you will find some has Arab or Ethiopian ancestry, Pick Northern Chineses and you will find some that look, strangely, close to whites.
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I really want to understand this. In Latin America you can be of completely West-African appearance but because of one mixed race parent or Grandparent you can still be considered Mulatta/Mulatto in spite of your appearance?
The common belief that Latin Americans are sort of blind to "racial" differences is not right. Latin Americans are very good to guess ancestry on people. Other matter is tolerancy and the acceptancy of intermarriage.
Latin Americans look noses, facial proportions, eyebrow arcs, shape and form of lips, lenght of face, etc. And they can predict quite closely the real ancestry of people. Specially in Mixed people. Including if they arabs, part nordic, etc. Color of skin is a reference only.
Mulattoes and Mestizos usually show the degree of ancestry in the features of the face rather than in the color of skin. Yes, it is quite common siblings have quite different color of skin but the same facial features.
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Even if you're not a professional athlete, fashion model, actor, or celebrity? Wow. So it's kind of like the ODR in reverse then. One drop of "non black blood" and you're no longer considered black? If true this is fascinating considering how very different the mindset is in the U.S.
Not really an ODR rule. Latin Americans use certain description of people, mainly for identification. If one is a police, yes one has to use terms like mulatto, black, white or moreno to describe the suspects. Also, if one is looking for an actress will specify those things. However, Latin Americans usually don't care much for purity (althogh we see). We care about beauty, not purity. That's why we always get the prettiest girls
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Naomi herself has admited she never knew her biological father. Therefore he may or may not be of mixed race. Some parents tell their children all sorts of things that turn out to be not true...
Well, perhaps she is not "mixed", however her mother is Jamaican, so the probabilities are high she actually is. Besides, I might be wrong, but she does look like a dark skinned mulatta to me. Mulattas are considered quite pretty by latinos, anyways.
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Naomi naturally has brown eyes but often wears green and sometimes blue contacts. She also wears hair weaves/wigs (as do most female celebrities regardless of "race") which Europeanizes her African looks more so.
Yes. She can wear contacts and color her hair, but the face proportions and features do show European influences. I don't know how to describe them, it is just obvious to me.
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Still, even dark 50/50 black white biracials are usually distinguishable from the Naomi Campbells and Tyson Beckfords of the world.
Well, perhaps she is just 25-75. I really don't know. I found she is pretty, anyways.
This is also the first time I've heard Ms. Campbell considered a mulatto. I simply disagree. Ms. Campbell is in the same camp as Tyson Beckford, both having a very mixed background, but being of predominantly black heritage.
To be considered a mulatto, one should have predominate black AND white heritage, which Ms. Campbell clearly doesn't have.
Joined: 30 Mar 2005 {Posts: 1057 } Location: New Jersey
Posted: Fri 21 Apr 2006 13:36 Post subject:
What this whole thread has done is to reinforce the fact that "racial" perceptions are just that -- perceptions. And we all know how different cultures, and different individuals, perceive things differently. As Frank has stated, American children are "taught" how to perceive "racial" traits important to Americans, e.g., lip size, nose shape, skin color, hair texture, etc. In other countries, people are indoctrinated differently. Perhaps in some countries, people's perceptions aren't influenced by the society's opinions at large, because the society at large doesn't have any opinions; in these cases, individuals are truly free to make up their own minds.
Incidentally, since the words mulatto and mestizo were discussed above, I can add that in Portugal a few centuries back, the descendants of African-European unions were often referred to as mestiços. I found this in an excerpt from an old Portuguese history quoted in Carlos Machado's My Portugal. The passage said that Afro-European types were prized as mistresses (but not necessarily as wives) in Portugal and other areas of southern Europe, like France, Spain, Italy, etc.
What this whole thread has done is to reinforce the fact that "racial" perceptions are just that -- perceptions. And we all know how different cultures, and different individuals, perceive things differently. As Frank has stated, American children are "taught" how to perceive "racial" traits important to Americans, e.g., lip size, nose shape, skin color, hair texture, etc.
True and I believe, depending on where you live, packaging plays a role. Similar appearing people with the same ancestral mix can be perceived differently if their nationalities are different. For example, African ancestry may not be readily perceived in a Puerto Rican, even if it is obvious, because they are Latino and assumed to be part of a race known as Hispanic.
In contrast, the African ancestry of a non-Latino person whose appearance is identical is somehow more apparent to some people. At least that has been my experience.
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sat 22 Apr 2006 04:31 Post subject: A myth
G-Man wrote:
True and I believe, depending on where you live, packaging plays a role. Similar appearing people with the same ancestral mix can be perceived differently if their nationalities are different. For example, African ancestry may not be readily perceived in a Puerto Rican, even if it is obvious, because they are Latino and assumed to be part of a race known as Hispanic.
In contrast, the African ancestry of a non-Latino person whose appearance is identical is somehow more apparent to some people. At least that has been my experience.
Hi,
I believe the idea Latinos are blind to phenotypes is a myth.
South Americans from mestizo countries make fun of Cubans (in a friendly way, of course), for example, because of the obvious African ancestry. And people can identity an Arab a mile away. At the same time Spaniards find at once the Indian "hidden" side of most people of Latin America. And we also notice, at once, the difference between a White American and a White South African for instance, very different groups indeed.
The thing is that, although we notice the physical differences in our populations, we consider all of them OUR people anyways. We all belong to the same tobby club, or fraternity, called Hispanic or Latin world.
Our attitude has nothing to do with race but with the acceptancy that Latinos of all cultures and mixtures are a single people and a single identity. Not a single race but a fusion.
Race for us is just variety. For us, uniform people seem so boring. Countries of clones, where all people look the same is really our nightmare
Imagine all the girlfriends one has in live looked all the same! Like made in series by an industrial machine. It is not better to have a girfriend that look chinese, the next to be blond, the one that follows to be black, and the other native?
That's fun! And that's why we seem to be a happier people, anyways
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sat 22 Apr 2006 04:48 Post subject: To William
William wrote:
.. The passage said that Afro-European types were prized as mistresses (but not necessarily as wives) in Portugal and other areas of southern Europe, like France, Spain, Italy, etc.
Hi William,
Pretty mulattas has always being appreciated in Latin America and Southern Eurore because a simple reason: mixes produce some of the most beautiful women of the world. That's not theory or a "hidden agenda". Is just fact.
The most beautiful women are mulattas and mestizas, because of the following.
The so called "pure" races all have certain physical "defects" people don't usually notice, when inside those groups. Please don't call me racist to point some things:
Black women: small breast, wide nose, thick lips, too curly hair.
White women: squeare jaw, flat back, body hair, too long faces and noses.
Indian women: Too short, not perfect shape, face too round
Now, imagine a women where the defects of the different races cancel out!
Mixtures cancel out features that has been exagerated by the centuries of isolation of each "pure" race. That's why many times the result of mixtures is women of extraordinary beauty.
Of course not all mixed produce nice results. Sometimes the "defects" don't cancel out but add up!
Yes, certainly mulattas are some of the prettiest women of the world.
You really need to travel more The cariety among your "White, "Black" and "Indian" women are a lot more than you imagine and those "defects" donot exist in all populations.
Posted: Sat 22 Apr 2006 12:11 Post subject: Re: A myth
oevega wrote:
G-Man wrote:
True and I believe, depending on where you live, packaging plays a role. Similar appearing people with the same ancestral mix can be perceived differently if their nationalities are different. For example, African ancestry may not be readily perceived in a Puerto Rican, even if it is obvious, because they are Latino and assumed to be part of a race known as Hispanic.
In contrast, the African ancestry of a non-Latino person whose appearance is identical is somehow more apparent to some people. At least that has been my experience.
Hi,
I believe the idea Latinos are blind to phenotypes is a myth.
South Americans from mestizo countries make fun of Cubans (in a friendly way, of course), for example, because of the obvious African ancestry. And people can identity an Arab a mile away. At the same time Spaniards find at once the Indian "hidden" side of most people of Latin America. And we also notice, at once, the difference between a White American and a White South African for instance, very different groups indeed.
The thing is that, although we notice the physical differences in our populations, we consider all of them OUR people anyways. We all belong to the same tobby club, or fraternity, called Hispanic or Latin world.
Our attitude has nothing to do with race but with the acceptancy that Latinos of all cultures and mixtures are a single people and a single identity. Not a single race but a fusion.
Race for us is just variety. For us, uniform people seem so boring. Countries of clones, where all people look the same is really our nightmare
Imagine all the girlfriends one has in live looked all the same! Like made in series by an industrial machine. It is not better to have a girfriend that look chinese, the next to be blond, the one that follows to be black, and the other native?
That's fun! And that's why we seem to be a happier people, anyways
Regards,
Omar Vega
Remember I'm looking at this from the standpoint of a U.S. citizen interacting and encountering other ethnic groups and ethnicities in the U.S.
On another note, if Latin Americans really considered themselves a single people, why are some of them unwilling to accept Haitians as fellow Latin Americans? They are Latin Americans. Can you really speak for all (Spanish-speaking or Portuguese-speaking) Latinos? Based on my own experience here in the U.S. and what I’ve read, many Latinos do not wholeheartedly embrace the idea of a united Latino people. Others embrace it half heartedly.
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sat 22 Apr 2006 12:28 Post subject: Re: A myth
G-Man wrote:
...
On another note, if Latin Americans really considered themselves a single people, why are some of them unwilling to accept Haitians as fellow Latin Americans? They are Latin Americans.
Hi,
That's a good topic. Most people of Latin America use the word "Latin" to mean Iberian Americans: that's peoples and cultures descendents of both Iberia (Portugal+Spain).
Many Latinos think that the world Latin is sort of artificial, created by the French to include Haiti. Other say, well, given Haiti has to be included in our part of the Americas then Quebec should be considered part of Latin America as well.
There also other group that just consider Haiti part of Latin America without restrictions. The ones that think that way are usually the more idealistic people.
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Can you really speak for all (Spanish-speaking or Portuguese-speaking) Latinos? Based on my own experience here in the U.S. and what I’ve read, many Latinos do not wholeheartedly embrace the idea of a united Latino people. Others embrace it half heartedly.
Latinos are really nationalistic. People don't feel identified with the neighbour country. Now, if there are differences in phenotype between the people of one country and other is hard to make them to feel the same. You can say many racial slurs to Latinos and they won't care. However, say a Mexican he is a Cuban, or a Cuban he is a Colombian, or a Chilean he is a Mexican, and that will be the worst insult of all.
Even though, when they need to work together, Latinos are able to break those regionalistic barriers. The sharing of language help.
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sat 22 Apr 2006 12:46 Post subject: Defects
Salsassin wrote:
You really need to travel more The cariety among your "White, "Black" and "Indian" women are a lot more than you imagine and those "defects" donot exist in all populations.
Hi Salsassin,
I know, I know. I am not blind. I just tried to make a symplified model, a cartoon in fact, of certain thinks I have observed. Not all northern European women, for example, are hairy; although some are. Not all have rude facial features but many do.
However, have not you noticed that some of the prettiest women that exist are actually mixed? For all that I know, men really got shocked when they arrive for the first time to places like Rio or Cuba, and find so many "perfect body" women.
In Hispanic America it is also well known that the mestiza has usually smoother facial features than the "pure" Spanish woman, for example. I have heared many people saying Spanish women have rude faces; or (sorry the slur) "faces of men".
I also remember the comment my dad say to me the first time he saw the White people of western Canada: "what strange faces people have here!"
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sun 23 Apr 2006 03:58 Post subject: Funny
Salsassin wrote:
Which would be funny because Spanish are already a mixed population in the first place. I saw stunning Spanish women all over Spain.
Yes. I have hear you saying lot of times Spaniards are Mulattoes. You believe it so strongly that I don't have the will to enter that discusion again. Keep reading Diop and Van Sertima and follow their faith.
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By the way and many more do consider Haitians Latin, just not Hispanic.
I think we should call ourselves Iberian Americans rather than Latin Americans, because people like the Haitians and the Quebecois have NOTHING to do with us at all.
Haitians are not Iberians (Spanish or Portugueses), and not mixed descendents of Iberians either. They don't speak an Iberian language but French.
They are an African people with a Afro-French culture. Haitians are French Speaking people, like most of Africa and other parts of the world. By culture and race Haitians have a lot more in common with Burkina-Faso, Burundi, Cameroon, Chad or Congo than with Argentina, Venezuela, Mexico or Cuba.
I wonder if the Quebecois feel close to them because they speak French. Quebecois and Haitians should feel like if they were brothers, part of French America. I doubt it.
Yes, Spanish and Portuguese speakers of the Americas should make clear in the United States what we really are, and what we aren't. And the term Latino is used, many times, as a synonim of Iberian American. Close enough, 99% of Latinos ARE Iberian Americans but 1% of it is not: Haiti.
Posted: Sun 23 Apr 2006 05:47 Post subject: Re: Funny
oevega wrote:
Yes. I have hear you saying lot of times Spaniards are Mulattoes. You believe it so strongly that I don't have the will to enter that discusion again. Keep reading Diop and Van Sertima and follow their faith.
Your racialism makes you project onto others. Neither do I buy into their racism, nor into yours. Spain is mixed because it has seen many migrations. That does not make it mulato,but it still makes it mixed.
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I think we should call ourselves Iberian Americans rather than Latin Americans, because people like the Haitians and the Quebecois have NOTHING to do with us at all.
The term is Hispanic, and Ilived with a Haitian and there were many things we had in common. So don't assume. O know your negrophobia is kicking in, but Not all Haitian culture is African. And not all of it is French either.
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Haitians are not Iberians (Spanish or Portugueses), and not mixed descendents of Iberians either. They don't speak an Iberian language but French.
Stilla Latin Language and their interaction with Dominican and Cuban culture makes them similar in many ways to Latino Caribbean culture. Furthermore, El Libertador Bolivar inspired himself from them.
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They are an African people with a Afro-French culture. Haitians are French Speaking people, like most of Africa and other parts of the world. By culture and race Haitians have a lot more in common with Burkina-Faso, Burundi, Cameroon, Chad or Congo than with Argentina, Venezuela, Mexico or Cuba.
Again your negrophobia is acting up. They have some similarities to Africa that speaks French Spanish and Portuguese,but they have more in common with places that have had African, Native American and European influence. Even if African is the predominant influence the others have been felt as well.
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I wonder if the Quebecois feel close to them because they speak French. Quebecois and Haitians should feel like if they were brothers, part of French America. I doubt it.
I'm sure they don't. Most quebecois are racist as yourself.
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Yes, Spanish and Portuguese speakers of the Americas should make clear in the United States what we really are, and what we aren't. And the term Latino is used, many times, as a synonim of Iberian American. Close enough, 99% of Latinos ARE Iberian Americans but 1% of it is not: Haiti.
Latino is not Iberian and Haitians are Latino, no matter how much or your negrophobia kicks in.
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sun 23 Apr 2006 06:45 Post subject: Here we go again
Salsassin wrote:
The term is Hispanic, and Ilived with a Haitian and there were many things we had in common. So don't assume.
Hispanic name does not include Brazil. In South America we do consider Brazil a country that is very close to us.
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O know your negrophobia is kicking in, but Not all Haitian culture is African. And not all of it is French either...
Stilla Latin Language and their interaction with Dominican and Cuban culture makes them similar in many ways to Latino Caribbean culture.
Perhaps is your Haitiphilia what kicks you. Haiti is an African culture transplanted to the Americas. Ask a Black person of Dominican republic about Haitians and see if they agree with you on that. Besides Brazil is plenty of Black people but we see they are connected with us at once. Nothing like that happens with Haiti.
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Furthermore, El Libertador Bolivar inspired himself from them.
That happens in a very remote past. In a time when Haiti was respected by everybody and even produced fear in White Americans. Today Hispanic Americans countries and Brazil have to give humanitary aid and all other kind of help to Haiti in a daily basis.
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Again your negrophobia is acting up. They have some similarities to Africa that speaks French Spanish and Portuguese,but they have more in common with places that have had African, Native American and European influence. Even if African is the predominant influence the others have been felt as well.
That would be interesting to know. From the outside you know very well Latin Americans see Haiti like an allien place in the "Latin" region.
Yes, they have lot in common with places that had African ancestry and French culture; all of which are located in Africa. I doubt they have any relation with Native Americans at all.
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I'm sure they don't. Most quebecois are racist as yourself.
Repeat with me: O is not negrophobic; O just don't buy the idea Haitians are part of Iberian America.
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Latino is not Iberian and Haitians are Latino, no matter how much or your negrophobia kicks in.
Iberian Americans is the name of the region. You know that! Jesus, are you really Peruvian after all?
In that case, Latinos will have to change the name. You very well know in Spanish we call ourselves "Iberoamericanos".
Latinos (in Spanish) are just Americans that speak Spanish and dance Salsa.
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You really need to travel more The cariety among your "White, "Black" and "Indian" women are a lot more than you imagine and those "defects" donot exist in all populations.