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mixedmom Moderator

Joined: 27 Nov 2004 {Posts: 782 }
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Posted: Sun 25 Feb 2007 22:09 Post subject: Label Induced Blindness |
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| I had a conversation with my mother recently. She told me that she went to a salon to get her hair styled and even let the beautician dye it brown. My mother is a multiracial woman who identifies as African-American. Her hair is actually jet black and has the texture of cornsilk. There is a substantial amount of Native American ancestry on both sides of her family. My mother told me that the beautician informed her that her hair wasn't actually black because only Asian people or Native Americans have black hair. The beautician insisted that my mother's hair was dark brown. She talked my mother into trying a lighter brown coloring. The coloring only worked on the touch of grey that my mother has at her temples. The rest of her hair remained jet black as it was before. It's crazy that because of this sketchy information associated with a "black" label, this beautician wasn't able to see what was in plain view, right in front of her face, my mother's JET BLACK hair. |
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Dragon Horse SuperMentor

Joined: 07 Feb 2007 {Posts: 1828 } Location: Lookin DC Metro, Feelin Geneva
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Posted: Mon 26 Feb 2007 00:45 Post subject: |
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That hair dresser was a little unimformed (to be polite)....my wife's hair (like many Japanese) is dark brown naturally. I would say a majority of Japanese kids have brown hair and typically it turns black as they get older (like by the time they are 4 or 5)...but some never turns all the way black.  |
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mixedmom Moderator

Joined: 27 Nov 2004 {Posts: 782 }
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Posted: Mon 26 Feb 2007 01:18 Post subject: |
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| Dragon Horse wrote: | That hair dresser was a little unimformed (to be polite)....my wife's hair (like many Japanese) is dark brown naturally. I would say a majority of Japanese kids have brown hair and typically it turns black as they get older (like by the time they are 4 or 5)...but some never turns all the way black.  |
Unfortunately, this is not the first time that I've heard this said about AAs by AAs. I don't know where this information came from but apparently quite a few people believe this. What astounds me is that the evidence to the contrary was right there in front of the hairdresser's face and yet she failed to see my mother's true hair color due to the combination of my mother's self identity as an AA and her (the beautician's) "knowledge" that ONLY Asians and Native Americans can have true black hair. |
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gemini072 Moderator

Joined: 27 Nov 2004 {Posts: 2942 }
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Posted: Mon 26 Feb 2007 14:08 Post subject: |
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| mixedmom wrote: | | Dragon Horse wrote: | That hair dresser was a little unimformed (to be polite)....my wife's hair (like many Japanese) is dark brown naturally. I would say a majority of Japanese kids have brown hair and typically it turns black as they get older (like by the time they are 4 or 5)...but some never turns all the way black.  |
Unfortunately, this is not the first time that I've heard this said about AAs by AAs. I don't know where this information came from but apparently quite a few people believe this. What astounds me is that the evidence to the contrary was right there in front of the hairdresser's face and yet she failed to see my mother's true hair color due to the combination of my mother's self identity as an AA and her (the beautician's) "knowledge" that ONLY Asians and Native Americans can have true black hair. |
lol I've heard that said as well by a black woman, it was in reference to my hair being brown. Mine get's lighter in the sun/warmer months.
But I've also heard that is a general thought in the beauty salon world. My sister in law owns a hair salon and her circle is mainly white women. And she was told something similar. |
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gemini072 Moderator

Joined: 27 Nov 2004 {Posts: 2942 }
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Posted: Mon 26 Feb 2007 14:16 Post subject: |
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Salsassin SuperWizard

Joined: 04 Apr 2005 {Posts: 3515 }
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Posted: Tue 27 Feb 2007 01:48 Post subject: |
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| gemini072 wrote: |
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Now if they had telephone numbers attached....  |
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Powell Guru

Joined: 27 Nov 2004 {Posts: 2448 }
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Posted: Tue 27 Feb 2007 04:01 Post subject: The danger of "racial" labels |
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Mixedmom wrote:
| Quote: | | I had a conversation with my mother recently. She told me that she went to a salon to get her hair styled and even let the beautician dye it brown. My mother is a multiracial woman who identifies as African-American. Her hair is actually jet black and has the texture of cornsilk. There is a substantial amount of Native American ancestry on both sides of her family. My mother told me that the beautician informed her that her hair wasn't actually black because only Asian people or Native Americans have black hair. The beautician insisted that my mother's hair was dark brown. She talked my mother into trying a lighter brown coloring. The coloring only worked on the touch of grey that my mother has at her temples. The rest of her hair remained jet black as it was before. It's crazy that because of this sketchy information associated with a "black" label, this beautician wasn't able to see what was in plain view, right in front of her face, my mother's JET BLACK hair. |
The experience of Mixedmom's mother is just one example of the danger of racial labels. If people are told that someone is of a certain "race," they will probably decide to "see" what they think they should see instead of reality. |
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gemini072 Moderator

Joined: 27 Nov 2004 {Posts: 2942 }
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Posted: Tue 27 Feb 2007 15:19 Post subject: Re: The danger of "racial" labels |
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| Powell wrote: | Mixedmom wrote:
| Quote: | | I had a conversation with my mother recently. She told me that she went to a salon to get her hair styled and even let the beautician dye it brown. My mother is a multiracial woman who identifies as African-American. Her hair is actually jet black and has the texture of cornsilk. There is a substantial amount of Native American ancestry on both sides of her family. My mother told me that the beautician informed her that her hair wasn't actually black because only Asian people or Native Americans have black hair. The beautician insisted that my mother's hair was dark brown. She talked my mother into trying a lighter brown coloring. The coloring only worked on the touch of grey that my mother has at her temples. The rest of her hair remained jet black as it was before. It's crazy that because of this sketchy information associated with a "black" label, this beautician wasn't able to see what was in plain view, right in front of her face, my mother's JET BLACK hair. |
The experience of Mixedmom's mother is just one example of the danger of racial labels. If people are told that someone is of a certain "race," they will probably decide to "see" what they think they should see instead of reality. |
Totally agree AD
I told this before of an experience in an art class, when we had to take turns posing for a min group of artists. And when it was my turn to pose, one of the male students(white) must have shorted out and draw me how a 'black' man is supposed to look instead of what I look like. |
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William Moderator

Joined: 30 Mar 2005 {Posts: 1082 } Location: New Jersey
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Posted: Tue 27 Feb 2007 16:39 Post subject: |
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A.D. and Ty have raised good points. My friend, Tracy, who is Black identified, but looks entirely European, mentioned that people always think of her as White until she reveals that she is Black. She is, of course, entirely aware that she looks completely European, and that most of her ancestors were European. When she tells people she identifies as Black, they then say that they can see it in her, coming up with all sorts of sillinesses such as "African" lip size, nose width, hair texture, facial structure, etc., that never were noticed before, and that aren't there.
Frank mentioned something similar about Mark Shriver, who was regarded as White, until he revealed that he had more than 10-20% African admixture (a surprise even to him). Then people claimed they could see it all along. Of course, this amount of African ancestry wouldn't be visible, anyway. |
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mixedmom Moderator

Joined: 27 Nov 2004 {Posts: 782 }
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Posted: Tue 27 Feb 2007 16:54 Post subject: |
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| Perhaps I should have named this topic Label Induced Psychoses. Race labels truely do make people see what isn't there and NOT see what is there! It's crazy the way that these labels can actually alter a person's perception of reality about another person when they don't actually fit the preconceived notions for a particular "race". |
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quin79 Regular User

Joined: 14 Mar 2007 {Posts: 60 }
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Posted: Fri 16 Mar 2007 23:18 Post subject: |
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| My mom is "black" and she has naturally jet black hair courtesy of my grandmother. The other day, my decided to perm her hair. The beautifican told her she didnt NEED to perm her hair. Thats what my mom wanted. But the beautican(she was black) had these beliefs. |
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sagascend Moderator-at-Large

Joined: 17 Jun 2006 {Posts: 2392 }
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Posted: Sun 18 Mar 2007 04:05 Post subject: Re: Label Induced Blindness |
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| mixedmom wrote: | | I had a conversation with my mother recently. She told me that she went to a salon to get her hair styled and even let the beautician dye it brown. My mother is a multiracial woman who identifies as African-American. Her hair is actually jet black and has the texture of cornsilk. There is a substantial amount of Native American ancestry on both sides of her family. My mother told me that the beautician informed her that her hair wasn't actually black because only Asian people or Native Americans have black hair. The beautician insisted that my mother's hair was dark brown. She talked my mother into trying a lighter brown coloring. The coloring only worked on the touch of grey that my mother has at her temples. The rest of her hair remained jet black as it was before. It's crazy that because of this sketchy information associated with a "black" label, this beautician wasn't able to see what was in plain view, right in front of her face, my mother's JET BLACK hair. |
How strange! I will have to ask my cousin/aunt about this (they are both stylists). My hair is also jet black and always has been. I question the "only Asians/Native Americans can have black hair" statement because my hair is the same color and texture as my father's and grandmother's (it looks almost exactly like the hair in the first picture that Ty posted, except it is blacker). I am unware of any Native American ancestry on that side of the family. My mother had a Native American grandmother and her hair is chocolate brown with auburn highlights.
Nevertheless - what an idiot. Obviously anyone with Asian/Native American ancestry could inherit the "black hair gene" if this is indeed accurate. Why not conclude that your mother has A/NA ancestry?  |
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DChapman Moderator

Joined: 27 Nov 2004 {Posts: 1762 } Location: Hudson Valley, NY
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Posted: Mon 19 Mar 2007 14:47 Post subject: |
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| Powell wrote: | | The experience of Mixedmom's mother is just one example of the danger of racial labels. If people are told that someone is of a certain "race," they will probably decide to "see" what they think they should see instead of reality. |
Yup, I can attest to this. My facial hair is straight hair (being I don't have much hair on my head be cause of baldness!! ). I have always used a regular razor without thinking about it. When I was in college, a guy who I think was Puerto Rican said to me, "What are you using that razor for?? How come you don't use the black man's razor?? You GET bumps...." I told him I always used this razor since I started shaving at 15, and I never had bumps because the hair that grows on my face is not curly. He looked confused.
A friend at the same school was was Jewish was taking medication because he was losing his hair. This was before Rogaine (sp?) in the mid '80s. I said to him that I was losing my hair too. I started going bald at 23. He said I had nothing to worry about. I asked why. He said,"Black people don't go bald..." I said, "wow, interesting!!!" |
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Dragon Horse SuperMentor

Joined: 07 Feb 2007 {Posts: 1828 } Location: Lookin DC Metro, Feelin Geneva
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Posted: Mon 19 Mar 2007 15:09 Post subject: |
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| DChapman wrote: | | Powell wrote: | | The experience of Mixedmom's mother is just one example of the danger of racial labels. If people are told that someone is of a certain "race," they will probably decide to "see" what they think they should see instead of reality. |
Yup, I can attest to this. My facial hair is straight hair (being I don't have much hair on my head be cause of baldness!! ). I have always used a regular razor without thinking about it. When I was in college, a guy who I think was Puerto Rican said to me, "What are you using that razor for?? How come you don't use the black man's razor?? You GET bumps...." I told him I always used this razor since I started shaving at 15, and I never had bumps because the hair that grows on my face is not curly. He looked confused.
A friend at the same school was was Jewish was taking medication because he was losing his hair. This was before Rogaine (sp?) in the mid '80s. I said to him that I was losing my hair too. I started going bald at 23. He said I had nothing to worry about. I asked why. He said,"Black people don't go bald..." I said, "wow, interesting!!!" |
BLACK PEOPLE DON'T GO BALD..tell that to my grandfather...hahah  |
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