Since the thread on the origins of the Tango is locked, and I wanted to add in my 2 cents, I started a new one!
Anyways... I took classes in both the Waltz and the Tango about 2 years ago. The Tango is actually similar to the Waltz, certainly they are not one and the same, and the Tango is actually more difficult in my opinion. But they have some significant similarities... to much so in my opinion for the Tango to be pure African resulted.
I need to retake some more classes. Plus I need a dance partner to practice with.
It is so cool too, that Argentina has timeless dance like the Tango that never goes out of style. It is so cool too, that most or all of Latin America has a timeless dance like the salsa that never goes out of style.
The "Step" or "Chicago Step" done by many Black Americans is almost on par in venerable nature to the Tango and Salsa. Maybe not fully since the Step is parochial to here in the U.S. and the Tango and Salsa have more international renown.
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sun 16 Jul 2006 02:21 Post subject: Re: Tango
e harmoni wrote:
...
It is so cool too, that Argentina has timeless dance like the Tango that never goes out of style. It is so cool too, that most or all of Latin America has a timeless dance like the salsa that never goes out of style...
Hi,
And what's your oppinion of Tango songs? Has you get it?
It is interesting to note that almost all countries of Latin America have its particular timeless dances and musics. However, only a few has gone international. One of those are Tango, Salsa, Brazilian Samba, and Mexican Charro music. But that is only a very small part of the whole picture.
I remember a long time ago, in a Folk fest in western Canada, a group of Chilote (southern Chile) musicians started to play. The people was amazed at how close it was that to Irish music, and started to follow the rythm with the feet. And I am sure foreigners will get amazed if they discover Peruvian-waltz, Argentina gaucho music, Paraguayan or Venezuelan folk music, or the music of the Andes.
Latin American creole, folkloric and indigenous traditions are almost endless. There is something there for everyone.
Posted: Sun 16 Jul 2006 02:53 Post subject: Re: Tango
oevega wrote:
e harmoni wrote:
...
It is so cool too, that Argentina has timeless dance like the Tango that never goes out of style. It is so cool too, that most or all of Latin America has a timeless dance like the salsa that never goes out of style...
Hi,
And what's your oppinion of Tango songs? Has you get it?
It is interesting to note that almost all countries of Latin America have its particular timeless dances and musics. However, only a few has gone international. One of those are Tango, Salsa, Brazilian Samba, and Mexican Charro music. But that is only a very small part of the whole picture.
I remember a long time ago, in a Folk fest in western Canada, a group of Chilote (southern Chile) musicians started to play. The people was amazed at how close it was that to Irish music, and started to follow the rythm with the feet. And I am sure foreigners will get amazed if they discover Peruvian-waltz, Argentina gaucho music, Paraguayan or Venezuelan folk music, or the music of the Andes.
Latin American creole, folkloric and indigenous traditions are almost endless. There is something there for everyone.
Omar
Actually, my instructor gave everyone in the class a CD for each type of dance they were learning. So I got a CD with Tango song burned down onto and one with Waltz music burned down onto it. Since I'm a fresh amature to both (and maybe even that's an overstatement) I probably am clueless to the diversity of Tango music if there is a diversity in that genre of music. But from the CD's we got, I like the Waltz music much more than the Tango. I was surprised that the Waltz music was so modern too. Some of it almost jazzy to a degree. But the Country style Waltz songs I was not very fond of. The Tango songs on my CD, give me the impression of being very classical Tangoish from the 1800's or 1920's. Maybe I'm wrong... haven't listened to that CD in a while. Plus I'm not very knowledgable on music and music history.
If I remember correctly she either charged me $60 for each style of dance or $60 to learn both the Waltz and the Tango. I think it was the latter. I also think it was 6 classes for each style. The classes were on Sunday nights.
Believe it or not it was the movie "Four Feathers" I believe it was called, that got me wanting to learn the Waltz. I was enchanted by how the movie made the British officers seem to glide across the floor in their balls. Tango I have seen numerous times on movies for many years. And it always appeared as a very sexy and eddifying dance, plus the Tango dresses female ballroom dancers I always just thought looked so hot! So that got me to wanting to learn that.
I now know movies - like the one with Richard Gear and J-Lo - are full of it when they show people take about 6 or 12 classes and then enter big time competitions.
But both the Waltz and the Tango - which require men to "lead" - seem not to jibe well in an era that espouses equality of the sexes. Both dances also seem to have presumed homosexuals would not be dancing them. Being shy and less assertive in nature towards women... I found that both those dances demanded I confront those parts of me and learn how to "lead." Which was not easy for me I must admit. Actually I need alot of improvement on it.
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sun 16 Jul 2006 03:00 Post subject: Re: Tango
e harmoni wrote:
...
But both the Waltz and the Tango - which require men to "lead" - seem not to jibe well in an era that espouses equality of the sexes. Both dances also seem to have presumed homosexuals would not be dancing them. Being shy and less assertive in nature towards women... I found that both those dances demanded I confront those parts of me and learn how to "lead." Which was not easy for me I must admit. Actually I need alot of improvement on it.
Do I tell you a secret? There is not equality of sexes in Latin America at all. Men lead in Tango dances but women lead at home
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sun 16 Jul 2006 04:43 Post subject: Women
Salsassin wrote:
In fact, Marianismo in Chile was a major force in inhibiting woman's rights movements there. Much more so than Machismo.
I agree!
The Virgin Mary is a very important figure in Chile imaginery. It represents woman. Is not Marianism a common thing in Peru as well? I got curious.
In here woman has a lot of influences in the family level, but in the recent generations they have acquire equality in all the levels of society. I have a 12 years old girl and a 80 years old mother. And the differences in mentality between boths are astronomical.
Posted: Sun 16 Jul 2006 06:00 Post subject: Re: Tango
oevega wrote:
e harmoni wrote:
...
But both the Waltz and the Tango - which require men to "lead" - seem not to jibe well in an era that espouses equality of the sexes. Both dances also seem to have presumed homosexuals would not be dancing them. Being shy and less assertive in nature towards women... I found that both those dances demanded I confront those parts of me and learn how to "lead." Which was not easy for me I must admit. Actually I need alot of improvement on it.
Do I tell you a secret? There is not equality of sexes in Latin America at all. Men lead in Tango dances but women lead at home
I had no idea about this Marianismo. I always knew Latinas were socially raised in "traditional roles" but I didn't know there Yin to the Yang of Machoism. Fascinating!
I knew briefly about Sor Juana before. Poor, Sor Juana.
Of course with 4,000 books she evidently cared more about reading than most the girls raised in the United States today.
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sun 16 Jul 2006 14:09 Post subject: Sor Juana
e harmoni wrote:
...A good article in Spanish
..I had no idea about this Marianismo. I always knew Latinas were socially raised in "traditional roles" but I didn't know there Yin to the Yang of Machoism. Fascinating!
I knew briefly about Sor Juana before. Poor, Sor Juana. ...
And this is the oppinion of
Sor Juana Ines de la Cruz (1651-1675 Mexican) about men (not only Latinos )
The english translation is below:
(Hombres: Spanish original)
Hombres necios que acusáis
a la mujer sin razón,
sin ver que sois la ocasión
de lo mismo que culpáis:
si con ansia sin igual
solicitáis su desdén,
¿por qué quereis que obren bien
si las incitáis al mal?
Combatís su resistencia
y luego, con gravedad,
decís que fue liviandad
lo que hizo la diligencia.
Parecer quiere el denuedo
de vuestro parecer loco,
al niño que pone el coco
y luego le tiene miedo.
Queréis, con presunción necia,
hallar a la que buscáis,
para pretendida, Thais,
y en la posesión, Lucrecia
¿Qué humor puede ser más raro
que el que, falto de consejo,
el mismo empaña el espejo
y siente que no esté claro?
Con el favor y el desdén
tenéis condición igual,
quejándoos, si os tratan mal,
burlándoos, si os quieren bien.
Opinión, ninguna gana:
pues la que más se recata,
si no os admite, es ingrata,
y si os admite, es liviana
Siempre tan necios andáis
que, con desigual nivel,
a una culpáis por crüel
y a otra por fácil culpáis.
¿Pues cómo ha de estar templada
la que vuestro amor pretende,
si la que es ingrata, ofende,
y la que es fácil, enfada?
Mas, entre el enfado y pena
que vuestro gusto refiere,
bien haya la que no os quiere
y quejaos en hora buena.
Dan vuestras amantes penas
a sus libertades alas,
y después de hacerlas malas
las queréis hallar muy buenas.
¿Cuál mayor culpa ha tenido
en una pasión errada:
la que cae de rogada
o el que ruega de caído?
¿O cuál es más de culpar,
aunque cualquiera mal haga:
la que peca por la paga
o el que paga por pecar?
Pues ¿para quée os espantáis
de la culpa que tenéis?
Queredlas cual las hacéis
o hacedlas cual las buscáis.
Dejad de solicitar,
y después, con más razón,
acusaréis la afición
de la que os fuere a rogar.
Bien con muchas armas fundo
que lidia vuestra arrogancia,
pues en promesa e instancia
juntáis diablo, carne y mundo.
("You men". English translation)
Silly, you men-so very adept
at wrongly faulting womankind,
not seeing you're alone to blame
for faults you plant in woman's mind.
After you've won by urgent plea
the right to tarnish her good name,
you still expect her to behave--
you, that coaxed her into shame.
You batter her resistance down
and then, all righteousness, proclaim
that feminine frivolity,
not your persistence, is to blame.
When it comes to bravely posturing,
your witlessness must take the prize:
you're the child that makes a bogeyman,
and then recoils in fear and cries.
Presumptuous beyond belief,
you'd have the woman you pursue
be Thais when you're courting her,
Lucretia once she falls to you.
For plain default of common sense,
could any action be so queer
as oneself to cloud the mirror,
then complain that it's not clear?
Whether you're favored or disdained,
nothing can leave you satisfied.
You whimper if you're turned away,
you sneer if you've been gratified.
With you, no woman can hope to score;
whichever way, she's bound to lose;
spurning you, she's ungrateful--
succumbing, you call her lewd.
Your folly is always the same:
you apply a single rule
to the one you accuse of looseness
and the one you brand as cruel.
What happy mean could there be
for the woman who catches your eye,
if, unresponsive, she offends,
yet whose complaisance you decry?
Still, whether it's torment or anger--
and both ways you've yourselves to blame--
God bless the woman who won't have you,
no matter how loud you complain.
It's your persistent entreaties
that change her from timid to bold.
Having made her thereby naughty,
you would have her good as gold.
So where does the greater guilt lie
for a passion that should not be:
with the man who pleads out of baseness
or the woman debased by his plea?
Or which is more to be blamed--
though both will have cause for chagrin:
the woman who sins for money
or the man who pays money to sin?
So why are you men all so stunned
at the thought you're all guilty alike?
Either like them for what you've made them
or make of them what you can like.
If you'd give up pursuing them,
you'd discover, without a doubt,
you've a stronger case to make
against those who seek you out.
I well know what powerful arms
you wield in pressing for evil:
your arrogance is allied
with the world, the flesh, and the devil!
'
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Since the thread on the origins of the Tango is locked, and I wanted to add in my 2 cents, I started a new one! 
Anyways... I took classes in both the Waltz and the Tango about 2 years ago. The Tango is actually similar to the Waltz, certainly they are not one and the same, and the Tango is actually more difficult in my opinion. But they have some significant similarities... to much so in my opinion for the Tango to be pure African resulted.
Given her strength she'll help me lead. And we both gliiiiide across the floor.
I had no idea about this Marianismo. I always knew Latinas were socially raised in "traditional roles" but I didn't know there Yin to the Yang of Machoism. Fascinating!