Posted: Sat 22 Jul 2006 17:04 Post subject: Brazil Wants to Ban Mulattos and Give Blacks an ID.
Quote:
Brazil Wants to Ban Mulattos and Give Blacks an ID. They Call This Progress
Written by Janer Cristaldo
Friday, 21 July 2006
A stupidity cloud seems to hover over the Brazilian national Congress these days. Not that it would be easy to find any intelligent cloud over the Congress. But now there's a high concentration of stupidity and the whole country is threatened with a stupidity rain. Two projects, that intend to send Brazil two centuries back are being discussed in Brasília.
One of them, by senator Paulo Paim, already approved in the Senate, wants to send Brazil back to the racist America of the America when Jim Crow laws were in force or perhaps to the Hitlerist Germany or even to the South Africa of apartheid.
To be honest, I have nothing new to say about the matter. Since talks about quotas started I have been denouncing this tactic adopted by the black movements as something that will only serve to stimulate racism. The stupidity keeps moving on with ever increasing audacity.
While before all we talked about were quotas, senator Paim's project now intends to identify Brazilians by race, as it was done to Jews in Nazi Germany. Is the stupidity being repeated? This chronicler feels compelled to repeat himself.
I have already commented on the Statute of Racial Equality, when I denounced recently the extinction of the mulatto. With a stroke of a pen, the senator intends to extirpate from the country's history the most evident proof of the good racial conviviality. The expedient is elementary.
As blacks comprise a mere 5,4 % of the national population, the senator decides to call black the whole mulatto contingent, which represents 39.9% of the population. Give a little time and Brazil will be defined as being for the most part black. By the way, this is how the country is already seen by many Americans and Europeans.
The intention is to adopt the American model, which does not admit miscegenation. It's either black or white. Some intellectuals, able to escape the herd spirit that characterizes the species, presented to the Congress a document with 114 signatures, with arguments opposing the Statute and the reserves required by racial quotas.
Right away the document was satanized as the "White Elite's Manifesto," as if the mean white men were interested in maintaining the black population far away from their territory.
The government, which since then had been insisting on maintaining the academic quotas, felt compelled to back out. Now they are talking about social quotas. If on one hand it disengages the reserve of vacancies from the racial element, on the other it maintains the absurd purpose of sending to the university people who do not fill the basic requisites to enter college, ruining once an for all the academic teaching, which is already extremely deficient.
Paulo Paim put a goat in the room. The government removes the goat but leaves the rest of the animals in the room. That goes without saying that such a project is flagrantly unconstitutional. "All are equal under the law, without distinction of any nature," says article 5th of our Magna Carta. If the new proposal is approved, some will be more equal than others.
Good part of the black population liked the idea of winning with bent rules and they can't even see the trap they are falling into: having entered university through the back door they will be naturally rejected in the labor market.
Anticipating that, the senator has already added to his project a guarantee that the law will assure at least 20% of the positions in show or advertising on TV to Afro-Brazilian actors. The logic next step will be to impose these same quotas to the private sector, ending once and for all any merit criterion left.
The project also includes a mandatory course in high school, General History of Africa and of the Black in Brazil, as if Africa's history and that of blacks were more important for Brazil than Greece's History and of the Greeks, or Portugal and the history of the Portuguese, or Italy and the Italians, America and the Americans.
It would be interesting to imagine the way the new course will deal with the sale of slaves to the European whites by the black tribal chiefs of Africa. Or will it be a forbidden chapter of history, like the slaughter of Polish officers in Katyn forest by Stalin's troops, like the slaughter of 7,000 Spanish members of the clergy by the communist in Spain?
The senator's project still anticipates the creation of a special ID that will identify blacks racially. According to the statute, blacks will be required to carry their black ID card. It's funny to observe that in past decades the black movements had arrived at the conclusion that race doesn't exist.
Now it does exist and must appear in a document. Since whitening is quite generalized in Brazil, perhaps a better solution would be to create a tattoo or another very visible accessory, like Hitler created in Germany for Jews and homosexuals.
If such monstrosity is approved this country where miscegenation has always been the rule will start to officially discriminate by race. We are walking with large steps towards a black Nazism.
If such foolishness weren't enough, another project, this one from House Representative Pastor Amarildo intends to take the country even farther back in time, to Middle Age days, when the guilds controlled with an iron fist the exercise of professions.
Basically, the intention is to smother freedom of expression, regulating journalism, a profession that cannot be regulated.
If thanks to a decree-law passed by a military junta in 1969 only those with a journalism course can be journalists in Brazil, the new project, approved by the Congress in the quiet of the World Cup, intends to regulate even columnists and commentators.
Now, this dictatorial rule does not find a parallel in any democratic regime in the world. Journalist is he who gets his income from the exercise of the journalism profession and that's it.
The pastor's project is in reaction to the rejection of a proposal by Fenaj (National Federation of Journalists) to create a Federal Board of Journalism. That proposal was sent in 2004 to Congress by the Federal Government. Due to the pressure by the journalists and the media owners, however, the attempt to curtail even more freedom of expression in Brazil was withdrawn on that same year.
Again, the quotas. The white guild wants to protect the corporation. While the country was getting thrilled and distracted by the World Cup, the project was approved almost clandestinely in Congress. It now depends only on a veto or an approval by the Supreme Ignoramus, the president. It's amazing that such a rule would appear now in these Internet days, a time in which any citizen can start his blog and do journalism the way he pleases.
The Supreme Ignoramus, as it is known, has no love lost for the press. He might very well adopt such juridical excrescence. Right now when the Web has liberated journalists from the costs of paper, printing and distribution. Blogs represent today high level journalism and they are nimbler than the journalism on paper. The Chinese communists have already realized this and are censoring the Internet.
If he adopts this scourge, the Supreme Ignoramus will be fighting in vain against tomorrow's dawn.
Janer Cristaldo - he holds a Ph.D. from University of Paris, Sorbonne - is an author, translator, lawyer, philosopher and journalist and lives in São Paulo. His e-mail address is janercr@terra.com.brThis email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it .
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sat 22 Jul 2006 17:55 Post subject: Re: Brazil Wants to Ban Mulattos and Give Blacks an ID.
Hanzou wrote:
...Since talks about quotas started I have been denouncing this tactic adopted by the black movements as something that will only serve to stimulate racism. The stupidity keeps moving on with ever increasing audacity.
I agree on that. Afrocentrism will spark a strong reaction if it ever succeed in creating a political force in Latin America. Blacks are minorities everywhere (except in the Caribbean) so what will happen is not clear. Afrocentrism goes against the principle of equality of people because gives a prefference to a group in particular. And that will be hardly tolerated in here.
Quote:
As blacks comprise a mere 5,4 % of the national population, the senator decides to call black the whole mulatto contingent, which represents 39.9% of the population. Give a little time and Brazil will be defined as being for the most part black. By the way, this is how the country is already seen by many Americans and Europeans.
Do you see? Brazil is feeling the Afrocentric international campain already. That only could mean trouble in the long time. If the idea of equality is destroyed the only that remain will be racial conflicts, that in Brazil could be very large.
Forget Brazil history and heritage. All that matter is Africa.
(Perhaps one should look how is Africa today to realize what really is)
Quote:
The intention is to adopt the American model, which does not admit miscegenation. It's either black or white. Some intellectuals, able to escape the herd spirit that characterizes the species, presented to the Congress a document with 114 signatures, with arguments opposing the Statute and the reserves required by racial quotas.
Afrocentrists are Americanizing Brazil. Let's hope that country wakes up before is too late.
Quote:
Right away the document was satanized as the "White Elite's Manifesto," as if the mean white men were interested in maintaining the black population far away from their territory.
"Evil White man" is the usual rethoric. But nobody can say anything against the "evil Black Men" that are behind the Afrocentric movement worldwide.
Quote:
The government, which since then had been insisting on maintaining the academic quotas, felt compelled to back out. Now they are talking about social quotas. If on one hand it disengages the reserve of vacancies from the racial element, on the other it maintains the absurd purpose of sending to the university people who do not fill the basic requisites to enter college, ruining once an for all the academic teaching, which is already extremely deficient.
Yes. In Brazil is not "practical" to have racial quotas. How do you decide who is and who is not?. Social quotas exist in almost every country of Latin America. That's the way to go. Besides, why don't they take an intelligence test to enter the universities. After all to enter there one needs brains.
Quote:
Good part of the black population liked the idea of winning with bent rules and they can't even see the trap they are falling into: having entered university through the back door they will be naturally rejected in the labor market.
Yes. That the way the market reacts. After all Latin American countries are mainly "meritocratics". They select people for theirs skills, not theirs skins. If you mass produce Black professionals in the universities and they become mediocre of bad professionals, the market will reject them. And that will affect not only them but any Black that succeed at the universities by its own meriths.
Quote:
Anticipating that, the senator has already added to his project a guarantee that the law will assure at least 20% of the positions in show or advertising on TV to Afro-Brazilian actors. The logic next step will be to impose these same quotas to the private sector, ending once and for all any merit criterion left.
End of Brazil initiative. Beginning of American TV where Blacks are over-represented. For each four people you see a Black in American TV when the proportion should be 1 in 9. And they should show as many Hispanics as Blacks on TV because that is how the U.S. is today.
Let's fight for equality then.
Quote:
The project also includes a mandatory course in high school, General History of Africa and of the Black in Brazil, as if Africa's history and that of blacks were more important for Brazil than Greece's History and of the Greeks, or Portugal and the history of the Portuguese, or Italy and the Italians, America and the Americans.
Yes, forget Athens, let's study Zimbabwe. Let's forget classicals and start to read Yoruba. People forget that West Africa was in the stone Age when the settlement of Brazil began. Well, West Africa is still in the stone age, by the way. And don't forget that Africans sold the ancestors of Black Brazilians getting cloths, whisky and textiles in return!
Afrocentrism has landed in Brazil. Let's ignorance begin
Quote:
The senator's project still anticipates the creation of a special ID that will identify blacks racially. According to the statute, blacks will be required to carry their black ID card. It's funny to observe that in past decades the black movements had arrived at the conclusion that race doesn't exist.
Black ID? Yes, that's a good idea to export. Many Afrodescendents that look like the "evil whites" need one.
Quote:
Now it does exist and must appear in a document. Since whitening is quite generalized in Brazil, perhaps a better solution would be to create a tattoo or another very visible accessory, like Hitler created in Germany for Jews and homosexuals.
Black tatoo? That is a good one. It needs to be exported as well.
Quote:
If such monstrosity is approved this country where miscegenation has always been the rule will start to officially discriminate by race. We are walking with large steps towards a black Nazism.
Black Nazism. That's a good way to call Afrocentrism.
I am afraid if that happens, racial riots will happen in Brazil. Perhaps is better to dream on a racial democracy rather that start the nighmare of U.S. appartheid and KKK. But it seems that Blacks and Whites of the U.S. are achieving what they want: Americanizing the world. Spreading the U.S. racism worldwide.
Yes, Black and Whites of the U.S. are twins. They think exacltly the same, only that in the opposite direction.
Another new invasion from the developed countries has started. After patriotism, nazism, communism, hippies, drugs, porn industry. Now is the down of Afrocentrism. We still have not get rid of Nazis and now theirs Black sibblings are comming.
Posted: Sat 22 Jul 2006 22:15 Post subject: Re: Brazil Wants to Ban Mulattos and Give Blacks an ID.
Hanzou wrote:
Quote:
Brazil Wants to Ban Mulattos and Give Blacks an ID. They Call This Progress
Written by Janer Cristaldo
Friday, 21 July 2006
A stupidity cloud seems to hover over the Brazilian national Congress these days. Not that it would be easy to find any intelligent cloud over the Congress. But now there's a high concentration of stupidity and the whole country is threatened with a stupidity rain. Two projects, that intend to send Brazil two centuries back are being discussed in Brasília.
One of them, by senator Paulo Paim, already approved in the Senate, wants to send Brazil back to the racist America of the America when Jim Crow laws were in force or perhaps to the Hitlerist Germany or even to the South Africa of apartheid.
To be honest, I have nothing new to say about the matter. Since talks about quotas started I have been denouncing this tactic adopted by the black movements as something that will only serve to stimulate racism. The stupidity keeps moving on with ever increasing audacity.
While before all we talked about were quotas, senator Paim's project now intends to identify Brazilians by race, as it was done to Jews in Nazi Germany. Is the stupidity being repeated? This chronicler feels compelled to repeat himself.
I have already commented on the Statute of Racial Equality, when I denounced recently the extinction of the mulatto. With a stroke of a pen, the senator intends to extirpate from the country's history the most evident proof of the good racial conviviality. The expedient is elementary.
As blacks comprise a mere 5,4 % of the national population, the senator decides to call black the whole mulatto contingent, which represents 39.9% of the population. Give a little time and Brazil will be defined as being for the most part black. By the way, this is how the country is already seen by many Americans and Europeans.
The intention is to adopt the American model, which does not admit miscegenation. It's either black or white. Some intellectuals, able to escape the herd spirit that characterizes the species, presented to the Congress a document with 114 signatures, with arguments opposing the Statute and the reserves required by racial quotas.
Right away the document was satanized as the "White Elite's Manifesto," as if the mean white men were interested in maintaining the black population far away from their territory.
The government, which since then had been insisting on maintaining the academic quotas, felt compelled to back out. Now they are talking about social quotas. If on one hand it disengages the reserve of vacancies from the racial element, on the other it maintains the absurd purpose of sending to the university people who do not fill the basic requisites to enter college, ruining once an for all the academic teaching, which is already extremely deficient.
Paulo Paim put a goat in the room. The government removes the goat but leaves the rest of the animals in the room. That goes without saying that such a project is flagrantly unconstitutional. "All are equal under the law, without distinction of any nature," says article 5th of our Magna Carta. If the new proposal is approved, some will be more equal than others.
Good part of the black population liked the idea of winning with bent rules and they can't even see the trap they are falling into: having entered university through the back door they will be naturally rejected in the labor market.
Anticipating that, the senator has already added to his project a guarantee that the law will assure at least 20% of the positions in show or advertising on TV to Afro-Brazilian actors. The logic next step will be to impose these same quotas to the private sector, ending once and for all any merit criterion left.
The project also includes a mandatory course in high school, General History of Africa and of the Black in Brazil, as if Africa's history and that of blacks were more important for Brazil than Greece's History and of the Greeks, or Portugal and the history of the Portuguese, or Italy and the Italians, America and the Americans.
It would be interesting to imagine the way the new course will deal with the sale of slaves to the European whites by the black tribal chiefs of Africa. Or will it be a forbidden chapter of history, like the slaughter of Polish officers in Katyn forest by Stalin's troops, like the slaughter of 7,000 Spanish members of the clergy by the communist in Spain?
The senator's project still anticipates the creation of a special ID that will identify blacks racially. According to the statute, blacks will be required to carry their black ID card. It's funny to observe that in past decades the black movements had arrived at the conclusion that race doesn't exist.
Now it does exist and must appear in a document. Since whitening is quite generalized in Brazil, perhaps a better solution would be to create a tattoo or another very visible accessory, like Hitler created in Germany for Jews and homosexuals.
If such monstrosity is approved this country where miscegenation has always been the rule will start to officially discriminate by race. We are walking with large steps towards a black Nazism.
If such foolishness weren't enough, another project, this one from House Representative Pastor Amarildo intends to take the country even farther back in time, to Middle Age days, when the guilds controlled with an iron fist the exercise of professions.
Basically, the intention is to smother freedom of expression, regulating journalism, a profession that cannot be regulated.
If thanks to a decree-law passed by a military junta in 1969 only those with a journalism course can be journalists in Brazil, the new project, approved by the Congress in the quiet of the World Cup, intends to regulate even columnists and commentators.
Now, this dictatorial rule does not find a parallel in any democratic regime in the world. Journalist is he who gets his income from the exercise of the journalism profession and that's it.
The pastor's project is in reaction to the rejection of a proposal by Fenaj (National Federation of Journalists) to create a Federal Board of Journalism. That proposal was sent in 2004 to Congress by the Federal Government. Due to the pressure by the journalists and the media owners, however, the attempt to curtail even more freedom of expression in Brazil was withdrawn on that same year.
Again, the quotas. The white guild wants to protect the corporation. While the country was getting thrilled and distracted by the World Cup, the project was approved almost clandestinely in Congress. It now depends only on a veto or an approval by the Supreme Ignoramus, the president. It's amazing that such a rule would appear now in these Internet days, a time in which any citizen can start his blog and do journalism the way he pleases.
The Supreme Ignoramus, as it is known, has no love lost for the press. He might very well adopt such juridical excrescence. Right now when the Web has liberated journalists from the costs of paper, printing and distribution. Blogs represent today high level journalism and they are nimbler than the journalism on paper. The Chinese communists have already realized this and are censoring the Internet.
If he adopts this scourge, the Supreme Ignoramus will be fighting in vain against tomorrow's dawn.
Janer Cristaldo - he holds a Ph.D. from University of Paris, Sorbonne - is an author, translator, lawyer, philosopher and journalist and lives in São Paulo. His e-mail address is janercr@terra.com.brThis email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it .
I think this is a great idea!!! Brazil needs more racial conciousness... How can one create a country where they say race does not exist and then have blacks and mulatto's be 3X underrepresented in all the important things(university etc)
Posted: Sat 22 Jul 2006 22:22 Post subject: Re: Brazil Wants to Ban Mulattos and Give Blacks an ID.
oevega wrote:
Hanzou wrote:
...Since talks about quotas started I have been denouncing this tactic adopted by the black movements as something that will only serve to stimulate racism. The stupidity keeps moving on with ever increasing audacity.
I agree on that. Afrocentrism will spark a strong reaction if it ever succeed in creating a political force in Latin America. Blacks are minorities everywhere (except in the Caribbean) so what will happen is not clear. Afrocentrism goes against the principle of equality of people because gives a prefference to a group in particular. And that will be hardly tolerated in here.
Quote:
As blacks comprise a mere 5,4 % of the national population, the senator decides to call black the whole mulatto contingent, which represents 39.9% of the population. Give a little time and Brazil will be defined as being for the most part black. By the way, this is how the country is already seen by many Americans and Europeans.
Do you see? Brazil is feeling the Afrocentric international campain already. That only could mean trouble in the long time. If the idea of equality is destroyed the only that remain will be racial conflicts, that in Brazil could be very large.
Forget Brazil history and heritage. All that matter is Africa.
(Perhaps one should look how is Africa today to realize what really is)
Quote:
The intention is to adopt the American model, which does not admit miscegenation. It's either black or white. Some intellectuals, able to escape the herd spirit that characterizes the species, presented to the Congress a document with 114 signatures, with arguments opposing the Statute and the reserves required by racial quotas.
Afrocentrists are Americanizing Brazil. Let's hope that country wakes up before is too late.
Quote:
Right away the document was satanized as the "White Elite's Manifesto," as if the mean white men were interested in maintaining the black population far away from their territory.
"Evil White man" is the usual rethoric. But nobody can say anything against the "evil Black Men" that are behind the Afrocentric movement worldwide.
Quote:
The government, which since then had been insisting on maintaining the academic quotas, felt compelled to back out. Now they are talking about social quotas. If on one hand it disengages the reserve of vacancies from the racial element, on the other it maintains the absurd purpose of sending to the university people who do not fill the basic requisites to enter college, ruining once an for all the academic teaching, which is already extremely deficient.
Yes. In Brazil is not "practical" to have racial quotas. How do you decide who is and who is not?. Social quotas exist in almost every country of Latin America. That's the way to go. Besides, why don't they take an intelligence test to enter the universities. After all to enter there one needs brains.
Quote:
Good part of the black population liked the idea of winning with bent rules and they can't even see the trap they are falling into: having entered university through the back door they will be naturally rejected in the labor market.
Yes. That the way the market reacts. After all Latin American countries are mainly "meritocratics". They select people for theirs skills, not theirs skins. If you mass produce Black professionals in the universities and they become mediocre of bad professionals, the market will reject them. And that will affect not only them but any Black that succeed at the universities by its own meriths.
Quote:
Anticipating that, the senator has already added to his project a guarantee that the law will assure at least 20% of the positions in show or advertising on TV to Afro-Brazilian actors. The logic next step will be to impose these same quotas to the private sector, ending once and for all any merit criterion left.
End of Brazil initiative. Beginning of American TV where Blacks are over-represented. For each four people you see a Black in American TV when the proportion should be 1 in 9. And they should show as many Hispanics as Blacks on TV because that is how the U.S. is today.
Let's fight for equality then.
Quote:
The project also includes a mandatory course in high school, General History of Africa and of the Black in Brazil, as if Africa's history and that of blacks were more important for Brazil than Greece's History and of the Greeks, or Portugal and the history of the Portuguese, or Italy and the Italians, America and the Americans.
Yes, forget Athens, let's study Zimbabwe. Let's forget classicals and start to read Yoruba. People forget that West Africa was in the stone Age when the settlement of Brazil began. Well, West Africa is still in the stone age, by the way. And don't forget that Africans sold the ancestors of Black Brazilians getting cloths, whisky and textiles in return!
Afrocentrism has landed in Brazil. Let's ignorance begin
Quote:
The senator's project still anticipates the creation of a special ID that will identify blacks racially. According to the statute, blacks will be required to carry their black ID card. It's funny to observe that in past decades the black movements had arrived at the conclusion that race doesn't exist.
Black ID? Yes, that's a good idea to export. Many Afrodescendents that look like the "evil whites" need one.
Quote:
Now it does exist and must appear in a document. Since whitening is quite generalized in Brazil, perhaps a better solution would be to create a tattoo or another very visible accessory, like Hitler created in Germany for Jews and homosexuals.
Black tatoo? That is a good one. It needs to be exported as well.
Quote:
If such monstrosity is approved this country where miscegenation has always been the rule will start to officially discriminate by race. We are walking with large steps towards a black Nazism.
Black Nazism. That's a good way to call Afrocentrism.
I am afraid if that happens, racial riots will happen in Brazil. Perhaps is better to dream on a racial democracy rather that start the nighmare of U.S. appartheid and KKK. But it seems that Blacks and Whites of the U.S. are achieving what they want: Americanizing the world. Spreading the U.S. racism worldwide.
Yes, Black and Whites of the U.S. are twins. They think exacltly the same, only that in the opposite direction.
Another new invasion from the developed countries has started. After patriotism, nazism, communism, hippies, drugs, porn industry. Now is the down of Afrocentrism. We still have not get rid of Nazis and now theirs Black sibblings are comming.
Let's hope this fever passes fast.
Omar
you know nothing about Africa... I have been to Ghana and it was not that bad... Don't let what the media shows skew you preception of a place you have never been to...
In relation to the country being racial ambiguous, the best way to tell who is black is to ask the police lol they seem to be very good at determing that...
Posted: Sat 22 Jul 2006 22:27 Post subject: Re: Brazil Wants to Ban Mulattos and Give Blacks an ID.
Quote:
I think this is a great idea!!! Brazil needs more racial conciousness... How can one create a country where they say race does not exist and then have blacks and mulatto's be 3X underrepresented in all the important things(university etc)
Then let's attack RACISM within Brazilian society. Let's make Brazil a more prosperous nation through racial equality and a better distribution of the wealth.
Applying a RACIST concept like the one-drop myth to an extremely mixed-race country like Brazil isn't going to end racial problems, its going to intensify them.
Look at the U.S. The one drop myth has done nothing but ravage the black community for centuries. You really think its going to make a poorer country like Brazil better when it has failed to do so in a wealthy nation like the United States?
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sat 22 Jul 2006 22:37 Post subject: Re: Brazil Wants to Ban Mulattos and Give Blacks an ID.
soserious wrote:
...I think this is a great idea!!! Brazil needs more racial conciousness... How can one create a country where they say race does not exist and then have blacks and mulatto's be 3X underrepresented in all the important things(university etc)
Well, do you mean if there are Blacks people is not equal anymore?
Racial conciousness will make the country split appart rather than stay together. What Blacks have to learn is to work hard to achieve by themselves. That's what all the rest of the people in this planet do, not only the white man. If Blacks want to go to the universities and fail in the admision test, should they be allowed to enter anyways? Why does a people has to have those PRIVILEDGES?
The problem in Brazil is where to draw the line that divides Blacks and evil-whites. You will see that is not practical a quotes system. And you'll see that racial tolerancy will be over soon, thank's to the American brothers.
Omar
Last edited by oevega on Sat 22 Jul 2006 22:54; edited 1 time in total
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sat 22 Jul 2006 22:51 Post subject: Re: Brazil Wants to Ban Mulattos and Give Blacks an ID.
soserious wrote:
...
you know nothing about Africa... I have been to Ghana and it was not that bad... Don't let what the media shows skew you preception of a place you have never been to...
Africa is the poorest region on Earth, the one that has more HIV per capita, the less educated of the whole planet, and the one that receive more foreing aid. Perhaps you went to a resort in Ghana prepared for tourists, and you got a good impression.
Now Brazil is a country with its own history, traditions and customes. I don't know why Brazilians should identify more with Africa than with Portugal, or better, with theirs own land.
Quote:
In relation to the country being racial ambiguous, the best way to tell who is black is to ask the police lol they seem to be very good at determing that...
Where, in the U.S.? You are going to bring U.S. sherifs to Brazil?
Your idea of Blackness is not something latinos or brazilians care. People identity is with the country first, not with Africans or Black Americans (in the case of Blacks), with Europe (in the case of whites), or with China (in the case of east Asians). Now, whoever dreams on FOREIGN LANDS is considered a traitor to its country and its people.
To the European-descendent that dream on Europe we usually invite them to fly and stay there.
Why should not push the African-descendents that dream on Africa to fly to Africa and stay there? If the loyalty is with Africa is not with the Americas and our people don't need them.
The point is that in Brazil 5% of the people is Blacks that look like the population of the U.S., 50% is white (yes you read it well), and the 45% that rest is 3-racial of White-Black-Amerindian and Asian. Why Brazil should change what it is to make happy the U.S. Black establishment?
Posted: Sat 22 Jul 2006 23:01 Post subject: Re: Brazil Wants to Ban Mulattos and Give Blacks an ID.
Phil345 wrote:
Hanzou wrote:
Look at the U.S. The one drop myth has done nothing but ravage the black community for centuries.
How so?
-It solidifies the myth of white purity
-It cloaks racism by propping up "blacks" with larger quantities of white heritage, while true blacks continue to be discriminated against
-It furthers the eurocentric model of beauty, since people with eurocentric features can be "black"
-It leads to racial seperation in the name of "black solidarity"
-It corrupts "black beauty" and skews it towards a eurocentric standard
-It denigrates black into an ideology, since its not a race, nor a culture
-It transforms black heritage into a "taint" that must be hidden in order to become a non-black person
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sat 22 Jul 2006 23:58 Post subject: Splitting families
Hi,
And the worst is what to do with multi-racial families, which are the largest majorities in Brazil. What to do when there are two sibblings, one white and the other black and the quote only allows the black one to go to the university?
Yes. Racism will go inside the family this time.
Look at the girl in the picture. Perhaps she won't get into the quota. And of the group who is Black and who is not?
This family does not count. They are Indians, not priviledged Blacks.
These kids are white? Well, at least they are poor and hungry people. They won't enter to the university.
Are they blacks? who is going to get a free ride to the U.?
Are they black white or indians?
I add pictures of multi-racial families in brazil
"Black brothers"
Who is Black in the family?
Multiracial couple. Who is the white and who is the Black?
Yes. I believe Afrocentrism is crap for people like Brazilians that are already so mixed. Why don't let them to be what they are: Brazilians?
Omar
Last edited by oevega on Sun 23 Jul 2006 00:14; edited 1 time in total
Posted: Sun 23 Jul 2006 00:13 Post subject: Re: Brazil Wants to Ban Mulattos and Give Blacks an ID.
oevega wrote:
soserious wrote:
...
you know nothing about Africa... I have been to Ghana and it was not that bad... Don't let what the media shows skew you preception of a place you have never been to...
Africa is the poorest region on Earth, the one that has more HIV per capita, the less educated of the whole planet, and the one that receive more foreing aid. Perhaps you went to a resort in Ghana prepared for tourists, and you got a good impression.
Now Brazil is a country with its own history, traditions and customes. I don't know why Brazilians should identify more with Africa than with Portugal, or better, with theirs own land.
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In relation to the country being racial ambiguous, the best way to tell who is black is to ask the police lol they seem to be very good at determing that...
Where, in the U.S.? You are going to bring U.S. sherifs to Brazil?
Your idea of Blackness is not something latinos or brazilians care. People identity is with the country first, not with Africans or Black Americans (in the case of Blacks), with Europe (in the case of whites), or with China (in the case of east Asians). Now, whoever dreams on FOREIGN LANDS is considered a traitor to its country and its people.
To the European-descendent that dream on Europe we usually invite them to fly and stay there.
Why should not push the African-descendents that dream on Africa to fly to Africa and stay there? If the loyalty is with Africa is not with the Americas and our people don't need them.
The point is that in Brazil 5% of the people is Blacks that look like the population of the U.S., 50% is white (yes you read it well), and the 45% that rest is 3-racial of White-Black-Amerindian and Asian. Why Brazil should change what it is to make happy the U.S. Black establishment?
Omar
In relation to Africa, it is a continent!!! There are places which are good and, there are places which are bad but, all the areas are not afflicted with the same problems. Like every other place in the world there are people that are rich and those that are poor... Africa's main problem is that many of the countries have only been free from colonialism for 40-50 years... Countries like America are 200+ years old thus; it is not fair to compare...
In relation to the police, I was speaking of the overrepresentation of blacks and mulattos in prison in Brazil... A joke that black activist usually make is that in order to tell who a black person is ask the police...
I disagree!!! in brazil black is usually a term people use to describe people who are very dark... Thus, people that might even be considered black (even in Africa) get classified as Moreno or other terms. Also, I don’t see the problem with Identifying the people of African decent because they are all suffering discrimination and, the more organized they get the more they can achieve equal rights....
In relation to "flying back to Africa" that is such a silly saying because the black people are just as entitled to Brazil as the white people... The blacks there also deserve the opportunity that was denied to them because of slavery. Brazil IS NOT A RACIAL harmony, ignoring race has created a country where people still discriminate but they don’t even acknowledge it. That is an even more dangerous type of racism than that which occurred in America... If Brazil was truly a racial harmony blacks and whites would be similarly successful.
In relation to Affirmative action, many blacks started 50000 steps behind white people in Brazil... What is the problem with giving them an advantage so they can catch up??
Posted: Sun 23 Jul 2006 00:16 Post subject: Re: Splitting families
oevega wrote:
Hi,
And the worst is what to do with multi-racial families, which are the largest majorities in Brazil. What to do when there are two sibblings, one white and the other black and the quote only allows the black one to go to the university?
Yes. Racism will go inside the family this time.
Look at the girl in the picture. Perhaps she won't get into the quota. And of the group who is Black and who is not?
This family does not count. They are Indians, not priviledged Blacks.
These kids are white? Well, at least they are poor and hungry people. They won't enter to the university.
Are they blacks? who is going to get a free ride to the U.?
Are they black white or indians?
I add pictures of multi-racial families in brazil
"Black brothers"
Who is Black in the family?
Multiracial couple. Who is the white and who is the Black?
Yes. I believe Afrocentrism is crap for people like Brazilians that are already so mixed. Why don't let them to be what they are: Brazilians?
Omar
You know as well as I do that racial ambiguity is not that high in brazil, there is the rich half and there is the poor half… The rich half lives in one region and the poor half lives in the other… Most of the poor half are of African decent… Thus, they deserve the advantage…
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sun 23 Jul 2006 00:28 Post subject: Re: Brazil Wants to Ban Mulattos and Give Blacks an ID.
[quote="soserious"]...
In relation to Africa, it is a continent!!! [/code]
Glad to know. It seems Black people has hijacked the name!
Quote:
There are places which are good and, there are places which are bad but, all the areas are not afflicted with the same problems. Like every other place in the world there are people that are rich and those that are poor... Africa's main problem is that many of the countries have only been free from colonialism for 40-50 years... Countries like America are 200+ years old thus; it is not fair to compare...
Africa is also 10.000 years behind the rest of the world. Not only of Europe and North America, but also of Asia and Latin America.
Quote:
In relation to the police, I was speaking of the overrepresentation of blacks and mulattos in prison in Brazil... A joke that black activist usually make is that in order to tell who a black person is ask the police...
Racial quotas for the jail? That's what you want now
Quote:
I disagree!!! in brazil black is usually a term people use to describe people who are very dark...
Black is people who is Black. Quite simple. That's a sylogism. If you look Nigerian you are Black. Otherwise you are mulato, zambo or anything else but Black.
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Thus, people that might even be considered black (even in Africa) get classified as Moreno or other terms.
In which Africa? Africa is a continent, not a country. You just teach me that.
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Also, I don’t see the problem with Identifying the people of African decent because they are all suffering discrimination and, the more organized they get the more they can achieve equal rights....
Did you see the pictures above? I will put bellow so you see them again. Please be kind to indicate who is Black, who is White, who is Indian, who is Mulatto, who is Mestizo and who is Sambo.
Besides, I will ask you what to do with multiracial families, that are quite numerous in Brazil, I tell you.
Quote:
In relation to "flying back to Africa" that is such a silly saying because the black people are just as entitled to Brazil as the white people...
The only people entitled to the Americas are the Native Americans and the ones that love their lands. The rest, the nostalgics, have the door open to go back to Europe, Africa or Asia. Nobody keeps them here after all. Americas is for people of the Americans of any color that love this place. The rest could and SHOULD go.
Quote:
The blacks there also deserve the opportunity that was denied to them because of slavery.
Black are free more than a centure and a half by now. How long will keep remembering slavery?
Quote:
Brazil IS NOT A RACIAL harmony, ignoring race has created a country where people still discriminate but they don’t even acknowledge it. That is an even more dangerous type of racism than that which occurred in America... If Brazil was truly a racial harmony blacks and whites would be similarly successful.
Success depends on intelligence and effort. That's the key. Brazil is plenty of poor people and most of them are not even Blacks, why the 5% of the population should have special priviledges that others don't have?
Quote:
In relation to Affirmative action, many blacks started 50000 steps behind white people in Brazil... What is the problem with giving them an advantage so they can catch up??
Affirmative action is African American bullshit. Welfare and affirmative action keep people in poverty and appart because mine their self-steem.
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sun 23 Jul 2006 00:30 Post subject: Re: Splitting families
oevega wrote:
Hi,
And the worst is what to do with multi-racial families, which are the largest majorities in Brazil. What to do when there are two sibblings, one white and the other black and the quote only allows the black one to go to the university?
Yes. Racism will go inside the family this time.
Look at the girl in the picture. Perhaps she won't get into the quota. And of the group who is Black and who is not?
This family does not count. They are Indians, not priviledged Blacks.
These kids are white? Well, at least they are poor and hungry people. They won't enter to the university.
Are they blacks? who is going to get a free ride to the U.?
Are they black white or indians?
I add pictures of multi-racial families in brazil
"Black brothers"
Who is Black in the family?
Multiracial couple. Who is the white and who is the Black?
Yes. I believe Afrocentrism is crap for people like Brazilians that are already so mixed. Why don't let them to be what they are: Brazilians?
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sun 23 Jul 2006 00:35 Post subject: Re: Splitting families
soserious wrote:
..You know as well as I do that racial ambiguity is not that high in brazil, there is the rich half and there is the poor half… The rich half lives in one region and the poor half lives in the other… Most of the poor half are of African decent… Thus, they deserve the advantage…
The poor half is not Black ONLY! That's my point. They poors are a mixture of Black, Whites and Indians. Don't you see the pictures above?
I chose them at random.
You will never get the problems of Latin America if you insist in your black racism. The problem of Latin America is between rich and poors, not between Blacks and White. Besides Latin America is European, Indian, Black and Asian in that order, so the only think that the Black ideology could produce in Latin America is more confussion.
Rich and Poors, remember. That's the divide, like in the U.S.
Well, in the U.S. you have been tricked by the rich to think in term of races. But we don't buy that down here.
Put your glasses on and look at the pictures once again.
Soserious, you act as if one-dropping multiracials into the black identity has made the US into some sort of racial utopia. Most of the issues that Afrocentrics state about Latin America also occurs in North America. Black Americans are still the poorest minority in the country, still have large numbers in the prison system, have high drop-out rates, etc. Some Afrocentrics even believe that "light skinned blacks" are treated better by whites and other groups than "true" blacks.
Let's look at New Orleans for example. Poor black Hurricane Katrina victims looked like this;
Soserious, you act as if one-dropping multiracials into the black identity has made the US into some sort of racial utopia. Most of the issues that Afrocentrics state about Latin America also occurs in North America. Black Americans are still the poorest minority in the country, still have large numbers in the prison system, have high drop-out rates, etc. Some Afrocentrics even believe that "light skinned blacks" are treated better by whites and other groups than "true" blacks.
Let's look at New Orleans for example. Poor black Hurricane Katrina victims looked like this;
Yet the "black" mayor looked like this;
Question: are you part black??
Secondly, I think you should realize that there is no mulatto elite in America... Where I live there are many mulatto's and, most are in single parent homes and living just like black people are...I think maybe your hunger to establish a mulatto elite blinds you to what is going on...
The ODR has not hurt black people in America... If anything the ODR has created organization within those of African decent and, has enabled them to achieve more than any other group of slaves brought to the new world... As you may already know "black" Americans are the richest blacks in the world... If black America were its own country it would be one of the top 15 countries in the world... Compare this to Brazil where the people of African decent are still living in terrible conditions and abject poverty...
Posted: Sun 23 Jul 2006 01:24 Post subject: Re: Brazil Wants to Ban Mulattos and Give Blacks an ID.
Hanzou wrote:
Phil345 wrote:
Hanzou wrote:
Look at the U.S. The one drop myth has done nothing but ravage the black community for centuries.
How so?
-It solidifies the myth of white purity
How does this conception "ravage" the black community?
In addition, the idea of "whiteness" being predicated on racial purity, exists without the ODR. For example, in colonial Lousiana, there were mixed race buffer groups, but the conception of "white" was still based in the idea of "racial purity", where a person had to be free of any discernable amount of black ancestry to be "white". If sombody with 1/32nd black ancestry is considered colored/mulatto, that "solidifies the myth of white purity", as much as the ODR would.
-It cloaks racism by propping up "blacks" with larger quantities of white heritage, while true blacks continue to be discriminated against.
"True blacks" (whatever that means), would be discriminated against regardless. Theres no ODR in Latin-America countries, and racism against blacks (which is prevalent) is largely ignored.
-It furthers the eurocentric model of beauty, since people with eurocentric features can be "black"
Eurocentric standards of beauty would exist regardless, even if such persons with "eurocentric" features were not called black. Evidence of this is in every latin american country with a large mixed population. The absence of a ODR would not lessen the "eurocentric model of beauty".
-It leads to racial seperation in the name of "black solidarity".
More race categories, leads to more racial seperation.
-It corrupts "black beauty" and skews it towards a eurocentric standard
the eurocentric standard would remain regardless... In other countries there simply is no conception "black beauty", and society (including blacks) just views blacks to be inherently ugly. The abscence of the ODR, would not make people realize "black beauty".
-It denigrates black into an ideology, since its not a race, nor a culture
How does the ODR make "black" not a race?? Its just a different conception of race.
-It transforms black heritage into a "taint" that must be hidden in order to become a non-black person.
the idea that black ancestry is a "taint" that must be hidden, exist without the ODR....and how does this "ravage" the black community anyway?
I dont support "one droppism", and coercing people into "blackness", but I dont agree with the contention that race relations would be so much better without it; its just a different conception of race, not better or worse. Racism is the cause of social ills, not the ODR. Different conceptions of race, manifest the same racism (white supremacy, and non-white inferiority) in different ways.
Additionally I dont think "one droppism", has affected black-american community as much as people imply. Most people who make up the decendents of black americans were not coerced by a "one drop rule", and its creation (in the early 20th century) didnt mean much of anything to most -- save a few small historically free multi-racial identified communities. Racial discrimination "ravaged" the black community, not the ODR.
Posted: Sun 23 Jul 2006 01:37 Post subject: Re: Brazil Wants to Ban Mulattos and Give Blacks an ID.
Hanzou wrote:
Applying a RACIST concept like the one-drop myth to an extremely mixed-race country like Brazil isn't going to end racial problems, its going to intensify them.
I partially agree with Hanzou; Brazil adopting a ODR would not end racial problems, but It wouldn't "intensify" them either.
'
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There are places which are good and, there are places which are bad but, all the areas are not afflicted with the same problems. Like every other place in the world there are people that are rich and those that are poor... Africa's main problem is that many of the countries have only been free from colonialism for 40-50 years... Countries like America are 200+ years old thus; it is not fair to compare...
