Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Mon 24 Jul 2006 04:07 Post subject: What Mesticos think of racial quotas in Brazil
Hi,
Mesticos feel discriminated by the Blacks of Brazil in the issue of racial quotas. Mesticos are mixed people of mainly European and Amerindian descend, (however in the article it seem he is speaking of 3-racials and light mulatoes as well) and they form a large fraction of the 45% of the people who is considered "mixed" in Brazil.
Read the following article in Portuguese. Well, if you don't read Portuguese will be very hard to understand how Brazil thinks, anyways
Omar
Quote:
Cotas: A Resistência dos Mestiços
Por WALTER PRAXEDES
Doutor em Educação (USP), Sociólogo e Professor da Universidade Estadual de Maringá e Faculdades Nobel.
Uma das grandes dificuldades para pensarmos sobre como implementar uma política emergencial de cotas mínimas para o ingresso de estudantes negros no ensino superior brasileiro, tendo como objetivo acelerar a melhoria na condição educacional e sócio-econômica dos cidadãos negros, é a resistência de muitos mestiços contra tal iniciativa.
Nós, mestiços, como sujeitos culturalmente híbridos que compõem a maioria dos cidadãos deste país multiétnico e multirracial, muitas vezes nos sentimos agredidos com a proposta do estabelecimento de cotas para os afro-descendentes que possuem a cor da pele mais escura, talvez porque ela contrarie duas importantes formas de ideologia que fundamentam a nossa “razão de viver” e nos motiva na construção de nossas trajetórias. Estou me referindo à “ideologia do mérito” combinada com a “ideologia do branqueamento”.
Uso aqui o termo ideologia como sinônimo de “ilusão necessária”, ou seja, como uma visão distorcida das relações sociais, mas que nasce da própria dinâmica das relações sociais, na convivência entre indivíduos, classes sociais, grupos étnicos e raciais, e encobre a reprodução da hierarquia econômica, entre proprietários e não proprietários; da hierarquia social, entre burgueses, camadas médias e trabalhadores braçais; da hierarquia política, entre governantes e governados; e da hierarquia racial, entre brancos e negros, presente nas formas de hierarquia citadas anteriormente, através de formas de seleção pretensamente democráticas, mas que negam na prática a possibilidade de ascensão social para os negros no Brasil.
O que fundamenta a ideologia meritocrática é a idéia segundo a qual todos aqueles que se empenham e que são competentes acabam aproveitando as oportunidades que surgem em suas vidas. Transformando as dificuldades em desafios o portador do mérito vence a competição pelas posições mais vantajosas no sistema sócio-econômico. Esse é o sonho que anima as chamadas classes médias a uma emulação sem limites, a um esforço sobre-humano, em busca da ascensão social.
Uma pergunta simples atesta a falsidade da ideologia meritocrática: todos aqueles que possuem o mérito alcançam as posições hierárquicas que desejam? Um interlocutor meritocrático poderia objetar: quem não consegue a posição desejada é porque não possui realmente o mérito.
Operando desta maneira, como ideologia, o mérito serve para responsabilizar o próprio indivíduo pela sua posição na hierarquia social, culpando-o por um fracasso que só é produzido porque a estrutura social é hierarquizada.
Como a maioria da população brasileira possui ancestrais negros, e como sobre os negros pesam preconceitos seculares que atribuem a eles as características mais depreciadas pela cultura hegemônica de origem européia, somando-se a isso o fato de que a maioria dos negros se encontra nas posições mais desprestigiadas do mercado de trabalho, para ascender socialmente o mestiço tenta se afastar do polo negro de sua origem biológica, cultural e sócio-econômica. Este mecanismo é denominado pelos estudiosos das relações raciais no Brasil como “ideologia do branqueamento”.
Em síntese, o mestiço que incorpora a ideologia do branqueamento quer se esquecer de sua origem negra, desenvolvendo uma identidade que torne possível a sua assimilação ao mundo dos brancos, considerado mais prestigioso, elegante e próspero. A idéia de que na sociedade brasileira vence quem possui o mérito é abraçada pelo mestiço, que é levado a acreditar que a origem étnica e racial não é tão relevante, afinal, somos todos iguais e é preciso ter competência para vencer.
Combinadas, as ideologias do mérito e do branqueamento encobrem a existência de mecanismos discriminatórios, irracionais e muitas vezes inconscientes, que dificultam o acesso às oportunidades de ascensão social para os cidadãos negros que não podem passar por brancos, como podem os mestiços de pele clara.
O que fica escondido por essas ideologias do esforço individual e da assimilação cultural é o fato de que quem não se “branqueia” acaba discriminado. Com pouca ou nenhuma oportunidade, um cidadão negro dificilmente desenvolve o mérito que permite a ascensão social. É exatamente para atender às demandas de tal segmento da população brasileira que está sendo proposta a implementação de uma política que incentive o seu ingresso no ensino superior, com um adequado acompanhamento pedagógico durante o curso – as famosas cotas -, que tanta polêmica estão gerando.
Enquanto não pudermos acabar com todas as formas de hierarquia que tornam explosivas as relações sociais, é recomendável, ao menos, que um cidadão não seja impedido de ocupar determinadas posições sociais em virtude de sua origem étnica ou racial.
Através do mecanismo emergencial das cotas espera-se que o acesso ao ensino superior torne possível que muitos negros desenvolvam as suas potencialidades. Os efeitos desta mudança sobre a condição de vida da população negra só podem ser benéficos. Já sobre o imaginário racista da maioria da população brasileira é imprevisível.
Dos mestiços como eu, acredito que um pouco de solidariedade com os que sofrem mais com os efeitos do racismo é o mínimo que se pode esperar. Mas talvez não haja argumento capaz de convencer quem possui um ponto de vista fundado em um pressuposto inconsciente e que faz questão de mantê-lo devidamente esquecido.
Posted: Mon 24 Jul 2006 17:09 Post subject: Re: Translation
oevega wrote:
It was just to highlight the point that to know Brazil one has to know, at least, some Portuguese.
Speaking as just a member, and not wearing my administrator's hat, I admit that I give no credence to any post regarding how citizens of this or that country should govern themselves if it is clear that the author has never lived in the country, and made a living there, and raised a family there, and established personal roots there. Unless you have done all those things, your opinion of their social mores is worthless in my eyes.
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Mon 24 Jul 2006 17:16 Post subject: Re: Translation
fwsweet wrote:
oevega wrote:
It was just to highlight the point that to know Brazil one has to know, at least, some Portuguese.
Speaking as just a member, and not wearing my administrator's hat, I admit that I give no credence to any post regarding how citizens of this or that country should govern themselves if it is clear that the author has never lived in the country, and made a living there, and raised a family there, and established personal roots there. Unless you have done all those things, your opinion of their social mores is worthless in my eyes.
I agree!
That's what I think it is worth to translate articles written by Brazilians like the one above, which show the possition of other mixed peoples that are not considered Black in Blazil, and that, therefore, can't apply for the racial quotas. The problem to understand it is the language barrier. I will translate for the group later at night.
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Wed 26 Jul 2006 19:06 Post subject: Hiring and promotion
odocoileus wrote:
You do realize that there have always been informal, pro "white" quotas in Brazil when it comes to hiring and promotion?
Why in the world are you getting wound up about something that hasn't happened yet in a country you don't know much about?
I believe the only criteria that should apply to help people is the economical status. If you are poor you should be able to get some subsidies. To enter to the university, quotas are not necesary, because admition tests don't measure race. Don't you think?
Quotas are racist against people that do not qualify because of race. Not all people is Black in Brazil for instance. Most don't have the "conditions" to apply for those quotas.
Joined: 05 Apr 2006 {Posts: 300 } Location: Chatsworth, CA
Posted: Wed 26 Jul 2006 19:37 Post subject:
US style affirmative action would be impossible to implement in Brazil. Everyone, except for recent European and Asian immigrants falls into a US designated protected class.
Most of the beneficiaries of AA in the US aren't "black" either. They're multiracial Latinos, multiracial Native Americans, and multiracial members of the black American ethnic group. Most of the "black" students at Harvard, for example, have a "black" father, and a "white" mother. The only "black" students w/ a preponderance of African ancestry are the foreign students from Africa and the Caribbean. Again, by US standards, almost all Brazilians would qualify for AA.
Even some of the "white" old money families in Brazil have sub saharan African ancestry, and acknowledge it. Would the govt. give everyone a DNA test?
Could a certain amount of informal social pressure develop to include a few token dark skinned people where dark skinned people are not usually seen? Sure. Is this an awful thing? Not especially.
All things being equal, being "white" or light skinned is still going to be a substantial advantage in Brazil, just as it is in the States.
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Sat 29 Jul 2006 03:37 Post subject: Quotes: De resistence of the Mixed people
This is the Translation of the article above called : "Cotas: A Resistência dos Mestiços"
Well, I got an awful English, and my mother language is Spanish, not Portuguese. But I did the best I could.
Very long paragraphs phrases are standard in Portuguese and Spanish.
Omar
Quote:
Quotes: The resistence of the Mixed people
By WALTER PRAXEDES
Doctor in Education (USP), Sociologist and Professor of the Universidade Estadual de Maringá e Faculdades Nobel.
One of the major problems to think about the way to implement a policy of positive discrimination of minimal quotes, to allow the registration of Black students in the Brazilian superior education -a policy that has the objective to accelerate the improvement of the education condition and economical status of Black citizens- is the resistence of the Mixed people, which are against such initiative.
We, mixed people, as culturally hybrid people, who make most of the population of this multiethnic and multiracial country, lots of times we feel attacked by the proposal of defining quotas for the afro-descendents that have a darker color of skin. Perhaps, because that contradicts two important ideologies that are basic of our "reason to exist", something basic in our way of think our lives. I am talking about the "ideology of the achievement" combined with the "ideology of whitening".
I use here the term ideology to mean "necessary ilusion", that is, something like a distorted vision of the social relations, but which is born of its own dynamic of the relations between individuals, social classes, ethnic and racial groups. And that explains the economical hierarchy between owners and not-owners; the social hierarchy between the burguesy, middle classes and workers; the political hierarchy, between governors and governed; and the racial hierarchy between Whites and Blacks. Those are the hierarchies as mentioned before, which allow supposedly democratic forms of selection, but which in practise block the possibility of social progress to Blacks.
The foundation of the merithocratic ideology is the idea that all people that work well are able to make use of the opportunities that appear in their lives. Transforming dificulties in chalenges where people of meryts beat the competion to get the best possition in the social-economical system. This dream inspire the so called medium class to emulate without restrain, in an super-human effort searching to ascent in the social scale.
A simple question shows how false is the merythocratic ideology: all those that have the meryth reach the hierarchical possition they want? A merithocratic ideologist could object: those who don't reach the desired possition is because they lack real meryth.
Working in this fashion, like an ideology, the meryth serves to attack the responsability in the individual itself for its possition in the social hierarchy, blamming him for the failure instead to the hierarchical social structure.
Because most of the Brazilian population has Black ancestors, and because on those Blacks are stereotyped with the worst characterists by the European culture, adding the fact that most Blacks are in the less appreciated working possitions, to ascent the mixed people has to distance itself from the Black pole of its biological, cultural and socioeconomic origin. This mechanism is called by schollars the "ideology of whitening".
In short, a mixed individual that accepts the ideology of withening must get rid of its black origin, building an identity that makes possible the assimilation to the world of white, considered more prestiguious, elegant and prosperous. The idea that in the blazilian society succeed who has meryth is embraced by the mixed people, who is driven to declare that the racial or ethnic origin is not so important but that, at the end, we are all equal, and that is necessary to be competitive to win.
Combined, the ideologies of meryth and of whitening, cover the existency of discriminatory mechanism, which are irracional and many times unconcious, that block the access to opportunities of social ascent for Black citizens that can't pass as white, like white mixed people do.
Hidden by those ideologies of individual effort of asimilation is the fact that who does not "white itself" ends discriminated. With few or no opportiities, a Black citizen hardly can show the meryths that allow social ascent. And precisely, in order to respond to the demans of that segment of the Brazilian population that is been propossed the implementation of a policy to incentive to entrance to the superior education, with the right pedagogical support during the courses - the famous quotas-, which so much polemics have generated.
No matter we can't end with all the forms of hierarchy that turns explosive the social relations, it is advisable, at least, that no citizens wouldn't be discriminated, stopping him to get to certain social possitions only because of its racial or ethnic origin.
With the mechanism of quotas its is hope that the entrance to the superior eductation allow many Black to reach their potential skills. The effects of that change on the living conditions of the Black population can only be possitive. And would impact into the racist stereotypes of the Brazilian majorities in an unknown way.
Dos mestiços como eu, acredito que um pouco de solidariedade com os que sofrem mais com os efeitos do racismo é o mínimo que se pode esperar. Mas talvez não haja argumento capaz de convencer quem possui um ponto de vista fundado em um pressuposto inconsciente e que faz questão de mantê-lo devidamente esquecido.
The mixed people like me, believe that a little of solidarity with the ones that suffer the most the effects of racism, is the least that we can do. Perhaps there is no argument that can convince to whom have view points bassed in the inconcient conviction that "there is not reason to remember what is already forgotten".
Posted: Mon 31 Jul 2006 14:10 Post subject: Re: Quotes: De resistence of the Mixed people
oevega wrote:
This is the Translation of the article above called : "Cotas: A Resistência dos Mestiços"
I agree with Walter on most aspects, but i do not agree with racial quotas.
adress the discrimination itself.
Example:
Blacks were discriminated in the majority:
discrimination in the workplace.
Lack of education.
lack of media representatiion.
Poverty
OK. then you make the laws that start with the concepts:
If you can show that you and/your group have been discriminated for their looks in the workplace...
If you can show that legal education opportunities have not been given...
If you can show that your appearance is less represented in the media than its percentage in the population..
If your income is below...
Blacks will be beneifted, but so will all those that fall in the same descriminated category.
Joined: 04 May 2005 {Posts: 2021 } Location: santiago, chile
Posted: Mon 31 Jul 2006 14:15 Post subject: Re: Quotes: De resistence of the Mixed people
Salsassin wrote:
oevega wrote:
This is the Translation of the article above called : "Cotas: A Resistência dos Mestiços"
I agree with Walter on most aspects, but i do not agree with racial quotas.
adress the discrimination itself.
Example:
Blacks were discriminated in the majority:
discrimination in the workplace.
Lack of education.
lack of media representatiion.
Poverty
OK. then you make the laws that start with the concepts:
If you can show that you and/your group have been discriminated for their looks in the workplace...
If you can show that legal education opportunities have not been given...
If you can show that your appearance is less represented in the media than its percentage in the population..
If your income is below...
Blacks will be beneifted, but so will all those that fall in the same descriminated category.
I Agree,
Perhaps the better is to give opportunities to the poors, with scholarships, housing subsidies and all those kind of things. Not selecting by how people look but based in the economical situation of the population
'
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