High School Teacher
Mentor
Joined: 02 Feb 2007
{Posts: 255 }
Location: California
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 Posted: Mon 02 Jul 2007 00:06 Post subject: What is a Straw Man argument? |
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To the Moderators(especially Tyrone):
In the thread entitled "Creoles, Cajuns . . .", the leading question is posed as follow:
| Quote: | | So the question is, were the Cajuns and white creoles in the past justified in trying to semi exclude blacks from being apart of their groups -- because they feared that blacks would bring in the one drop blood rule curse? |
Based on this question, how would you describe the topic? Is it about white creoles? black creoles? colored creoles? Or all of the above?
Subsequent comments that caught my attention were:
| Quote: | | The reality is creole is just a sub sect of the black American race, and no longer carries a separate identity like Latino does. Once upon a time creole had a separate identity from black Americans and this separate identity brought them social status and privileges that the average black America who was in slavery did not have. |
| Quote: | | This just verifies what I say that, creoles have become a sub sect to blacks. The fact that blacks get angry that Beyonce and Solonge are part creole shows that blacks don’t view creole as a unique separate ethnic group. They view creole as a culture but nothing more, because as soon as they saw that beyonce and solonge had black ancestry they put the one drop blood rule on them as claimed them as black. |
| Quote: | | What I am saying is that if you observe Beyonce you will that she is more black in culture than anything. The only major reason you here her mentioning and engaging in creole culture is because her mother is pushing the creole thing. It is the mother that is pushing the creole heritage on to Beyonce and Solange then these two mention it in public. But if it was not for the mother speaking on interviews about creole culture these two girls would not mention it very much. Beyonce and solange are more black in culture than creole in culture. |
My reply to the foregoing remarks was essentially the following:
| Quote: | | I noticed you keep repeating the point that Creole culture has become just another slice of blackamerican culture. It's as if you think there was a Golden Age of Creole culture that was free of black [influence]. |
| Quote: | My remark was meant to suggest the obvious: it is extremely implausible to assume and imply that the two major Afro-diasporic communities in the Gulf Coast region--black Creole and anglo-blackamerican--evolved without cultural interactions and influences going in both directions, even prior to the Civil War. If you think it is plausible I'd like to see any references you have to scholarship in the area of social history of the black Creole & anglo-blackamerican communities before the Civil War and/or Reconstruction.
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I was informed that I am erecting a straw man because the topic is about "Creoles in general" (before that, I was told it was about "colored creoles"). So you see I am a bit confused. I am looking for a fresh pair of eyes to examine the the thread for my straw man arguments.
It is true that the comments to which I initially responded did not explicitly state that there were NO socio-cultural interactions between creoles and non-creole blacks, but is there not an implication from the remarks I quoted that this interaction is downplayed or trivialized? |
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